My argument with a member... for the bulletin!

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Avatar of axelmuller

Before chessvibes became part of chess.com I used to subscribe to CVO. 

I did this because I visited the chessvibes websites almost daily and I felt that I should buy their product from time to time so that Chessvibes would be able to continue their free service. 

The MasterBulletin appears to be of higher quality than previous chessvibes products and the price for it may well be justified. However, the way it was introduced left some room for improvement as it antagonized a number of premium members. I also think that the price was a bit to close to a New In Chess subscription. I know, it's not really fair to compare the two products but you probably set yourself up for such a comparison by initially charging a similar amount.

Because of my free membership I might subscribe to the Bulletin partly for the same reasons that made me subscribe to CVO and partly because I like the idea that IMs and GMs can earn a bit of extra money.

Avatar of DanielRensch

Thanks everyone! Good thoughts by all. 

Really appreciate your understand and insightful opinions q-p. Such great, well thought out advice from a member clearly in a position to criticize Tongue Out

Thanks IM Bartholomew and pdela especially for their thoughts! pdela, after you subscribe let me know and I'll throw you a few extra issues for free because I love you so much Wink

Danny

Avatar of DanielRensch
ghostofmaroczy wrote:
DanielRensch wrote:

I think I make our approach and perspective pretty clear regarding the Bulletin and it NOT being included in a Diamond Membership, but maybe I am missing the point here?

Although maybe you could give it to David Pruess as part of his diamond membership.  Don't tick him off with capitalist behavior.

Hilarious Tongue Out - though I think David would pay for a good product!

Avatar of DanielRensch
Martin0 wrote:

When paying for diamond membership you read that you get "Unlimited access to all Chess.com features!". I think it is quite understandable that some people get a bit upset when they realise that they don't get access to everything. That being said, even if I had a diamond membership I don't think I would mind that the subscription for the bulletin is separate. I think that is reasonable.

Where is all the exact language of "what is included" in a Diamond Membership? I can never seem to find it. I'm serious Sealed - so if someone can show we screenshots where it says that and include URLS that would be greatly appreciated! 

Avatar of samtoyousir

Here ya go Danny boy! http://www.chess.com/membership?c=corner

Avatar of ChezBoy

Too much yellow! :). I initially thought it seemed unfair, however, after a previous posting, I now realize that content is being added to chess.com and not being taken from it. Sorry all, just thinking out loud. This post is probably just a waste of space!

Avatar of Martin0
CyberSensei wrote:

I guess I misssed it somewhere on this page (http://www.chess.com/membership?c=icon) but where is "Unlimited access to all Chess.com features?"

Avatar of Fins0905
Martin0 wrote:
CyberSensei wrote:

I guess I misssed it somewhere on this page (http://www.chess.com/membership?c=icon) but where is "Unlimited access to all Chess.com features?"

 

I agree that this should be clarified. Chess.com surely wouldn't want people subscribing to a Diamond membership under the assumption that they're getting access to the Master's Bulletin as well.

Avatar of ChezBoy

Or they could simply allow the bulletin to be free like they implied.

Avatar of Fins0905
ChezBoy wrote:

Or they could simply allow the bulletin to be free like they implied.

I don't want to speak for Chess.com management, but I'm 99% certain they have always intended to keep the Master's Bulletin separate from a normal subscription. A simple disclaimer stating that a Diamond membership does not include access to the Master's Bulletin would be a logical step.

Avatar of DanielRensch

Yep, we always intended this to be separate and have simply not updated these pages properly. 

Thanks John, Chezboy and Martin0

Avatar of Robert_Andersson1

@Martin: Den satt som en korv med räksallad ungefär :)

Of course the Bulletin should not be part of any mmbership or any product that is bounded for a long period, like a year. Look at all the other competitors they have same product, with quality up and down, Playchess (not commercial) has Chessbase Magazine for 20€ every issue and we have chesspub doing there thing with people like ..... Promising that superduper dutch update that never comes and so on but...

Chess. com is by far the best supplier of online chess today but they do not have the absolute best marketcommunication by far, and the etire work with CRM could be improved. But the Bulletin is a great product for that price compared to rest,

just my two cents

Avatar of DanielRensch

Wow, thanks so much Robert! I agree with you of course Wink - though I am biased! I also agree that a clarification will be needed to our memberships page!

We are in the middle of our massive redesign right now, so designing the memberships page to clarify that it is NOT a product included in Diamond will have to wait... #priorities Undecided

But I will challenge you with this: Show me at least 10 members complaining that they have not subscribed to the Bulletin NOT because it's not worth it and NOT because they haven't heard of it... BUT only because they bought a Diamond Membership and just assumed it was inclulded Wink.

When I know that people WANT it but are only missing out because of the membership confusion itself, we will change it yesterday Tongue Out - but I don't buy that that's the reason keeping people who haven't subscribed yet from doing so...

Avatar of Spiritbro77

Yes, you need to update the Diamond membership promotion to read "access to most chess.com features".

 

As long as you aren't siphoning off articles and videos that would have been part of membership in the past, as content for you new MB then I'll continue to buy membership. If those areas start to lose content to the MB....  then there are alternative sites to consider.

Avatar of sisu

I think it's fairly simple. Those writers cannot do a professional job (and it is their job!) if they are just volunteering their services all of the time, so the Masters Bulletin needs to be charged for.

Those players that are very serious about chess will acquire the bulletin, and those that are not, will not. Simple Smile

Avatar of hreedwork

I agree, Danny is a masochist! I mean that in a nice sincere way :-)

After slogging through this thread, and filtering drama and hyperboles, here is my USD$0.02 ...

1. Clarify in the membership page that Master's Bulletin is separate from chess.com, and therefore not included in membership price.

2. Keep adding high quality videos and related content to the chess.com site, and make sure to remind people of all the additions (maybe in the weekly email newsletter?). That way folks know they are getting the full value for various levels of membership, especially Platinum and Diamond.

3. Perhaps consider periodic special offers. You did some recently, maybe run the offer every now and then...

Honestly I think most of the kerfuffle (apart from dramatic flair and hyperbole) is lack of clear communication.

Avatar of Spiritbro77
sisu wrote:

I think it's fairly simple. Those writers cannot do a professional job (and it is their job!) if they are just volunteering their services all of the time, so the Masters Bulletin needs to be charged for.

Those players that are very serious about chess will acquire the bulletin, and those that are not, will not. Simple

I don't know, I think the articles and videos available to members as part of premium membership are very well produced. I imagine those writers and video producers recieve some form of compensation for their work. Probably paid for by membership dues. So I don't think it's accurate to say it's necessary to pay extra for quality product. That's a round about way of saying the stuff available to current members isn't of high quality.

Members do pay dues. The articles and videos we see now aren't free. At least not to paying premium members.

Avatar of PeterDoggers

Indeed, Fins0905! Here's some more clarification, especially directed at PrivatePyle99 and Aprentice1: The articles that are now being written for the magazine have NOT previously been available to premium Chess.com members for free, and in fact they wouldn't really fit on the Chess.com pages as they're perhaps a bit more technical, and directed to a slightly stronger audience. As a successor of the ChessVibes magazines, the Bulletin contains EXTRA content, on top of and different from what Chess.com has been doing for years.

Avatar of EDB123

so, our everything now has fine print. i just love extra add-ons, including 3x my weight in fine print.

Avatar of PrivatePyle99

That makes sense, I didn't see it explained that way. Thanks for the clarification.

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