Question: Can you mate with just a Knight + Bishop?
Sort:
Also checkmate
Not everyone is aware of this endgame though, or these questions will never pop up in forums. And the question in the title heading is meant for the general players in aggregate, not to a specific player. I would say that the technique is far from simple even for intermediate-level players.
Even a small group of (probably new or inexperienced) players find it difficult to do the basic checkmate of king and rook versus a lone king, as I once observed in a tournament where one young player ran his rook around aimlessly; fortunately for him, he managed to find the checkmate eventually.
eric0022 schreef:
lfPatriotGames wrote:
I can think of another one. But like a couple of your examples, it depends on where the pieces happen to be.
There are of course a minority of other uncommon cases, such as the following
where Black to move in the example would be a stalemate. Unfortunately, the position before White's first move is a forced mate.
You cab simply change that into this what I saw today by the way.
MARattigan schreef:
Can you mate with just a Knight + Bishop? The answer would appear to depend on whether or not you're the Tarrasch GUI with Rybka. I have just downloaded a fresh version of this on a new machine after my old suffered a nervous breakdown I tried it out with this endgame letting it it play the side with the pieces with 20 minutes on the clocks and got the following. This didn't happen on the old machine. The new processor is a 1.6 Ghz pentium with 8 Gig - I wouldn't have expected that. Has anybody else had a similar problem with Tarrasch?
This is such a shame because it is not that difficult for example.
Creeperslayer400 is wrong. It is not a legal position.
Bu the way is checkmate with bishop and knight possible on a 9x9 bord with the bishop of course has the same collar as the corner squares. For example like this it is possible. 
In all of my almost 70 years of playing chess--not once did i have a position where i would be required to play with K and N and B vs K.
Areliae wrote:
goommba88 wrote:
A computer has done it before but it cannot be done within the 50 move rule ( I think the fastest its ever been done is something like 120 moves
later dudes
Straight up wrong. The longest mate with best play is 33 moves, and that's with the worst position possible.
33 or 37? not sure
I can usually do it within 37-41 moves
Feb 7, 2018
0
#152
There is a book for free in Chessable to learn this endgame. The endgame is rather rare, I saw it twice I'm my games, once playing the strong side, once defending both successfully.
Feb 7, 2018
0
#153
Here on chess.com, go to Learn --> Drills --> Checkmates to find 2 different drills to help you learn this checkmate. It's the most difficult checkmate. I have learned it. However, in the very rare occasions where it has come up, I believe only twice in my life, it has been in speed games where I could not execute it in time. Still, it is comforting to know that it is in my arsenal should it ever occur in tournament play.
The ebook at chessable.com is the best!
Feb 7, 2018
0
#154
justtesting wrote:
Here on chess.com, go to Learn --> Drills --> Checkmates to find 2 different drills to help you learn this checkmate. It's the most difficult checkmate. I have learned it. However, in the very rare occasions where it has come up, I believe only twice in my life, it has been in speed games where I could not execute it in time. Still, it is comforting to know that it is in my arsenal should it ever occur in tournament play.
The ebook at chessable.com is the best!
Estrinian wrote:
Creeperslayer400 is wrong. It is not a legal position.
Why do you say that? What is not legal about it?
Feb 8, 2018
0
#156
I still haven't figured out how to do it from a random position. And so far, this is the only "edge" position I've seen! I'm getting tired of this exact position! It isn't that easy to get the bishop and knight onto those two squares...
Feb 9, 2018
0
#157
RubenHogenhout wrote:
MARattigan schreef:
Can you mate with just a Knight + Bishop? The answer would appear to depend on whether or not you're the Tarrasch GUI with Rybka. I have just downloaded a fresh version of this on a new machine after my old suffered a nervous breakdown I tried it out with this endgame letting it it play the side with the pieces with 20 minutes on the clocks and got the following. This didn't happen on the old machine. The new processor is a 1.6 Ghz pentium with 8 Gig - I wouldn't have expected that. Has anybody else had a similar problem with Tarrasch?
This is such a shame because it is not that difficult for example.
It can in fact be achieved slightly quicker. Your move 6.Nd4 allows the Black king back to the d1-h5 diagonal. Better is 6.Bh5 sealing the king behind the diagonal. Similarly Black in your example should have responded 6...Kg4.
I play White from the position after move 5 in your example and Black after your move 6.Nd4. The opponent in both cases is the program Wilhelm with the relevant Nalimov databases installed.
It is possible, its a hard mate, some tittled players doesnt even know that, but try to search the W method, it has to be on youtube, the first of course is to bring the king to the edge of the board but after that there is some theory of what to do, I have played more than 6000 games and I did that mate only 1 time
Feb 10, 2018
0
#159
RubenHogenhout wrote:
Bu the way is checkmate with bishop and knight possible on a 9x9 bord with the bishop of course has the same collar as the corner squares. For example like this it is possible.
Yes. In fact from the position you give you need only pretend the first rank and file are not there.
9x9 is generally simpler than 8x8. I posted some 10x10 examples where mate is possible earlier.
Correction: For the 10x10 examples see posts #114(p.6) and #147(p8) in this topic: https://www.chess.com/forum/view/endgames/bishop-knight-amp-king-versus-king
Feb 10, 2018
0
#160
chadnilsen wrote:
I still haven't figured out how to do it from a random position. And so far, this is the only "edge" position I've seen! I'm getting tired of this exact position! It isn't that easy to get the bishop and knight onto those two squares...
From a random position: move first slowest pieces, towards the enemy king. This means, move first the king to the center, then the knight to the centre (and pushing the enemy king with the king and knight as far as possible), and at the end you come with the bishop. You will be probably in the wrong corner, so you will have soon the setup to bring the enemy king to the other corner.
In more than 68 years of competitive chess--i have never had to play with or against B and N and K vs a lone K.