How do you know to play Nh2?

Sort:
DrStrawlanaevahi

I like to play Nh2, but I often run into problems so I have avoided it. Here Stockfish is showing Nh2 is doable. Why? There is also Nd2. It looks like it could reroute to the queenside. Would you have played Nh2 or do you think a rook move (other move) is better?

DrStrawlanaevahi

"Nh2 is a good knight outpost."

I never saw it as an "outpost". I thought it was more used for central pawn positions in the offense attacking sense. Once the king moves in defense territory, it's no longer protected.

 

"Also, could you explain what worries you have playing Nh2?"

The worry is that I put previous games in and Stockfish shows Nh2 was not in the top set of moves. Other moves were considerably better.

 

Maybe if someone can tell me WHAT TO DO with Nh2 then I could see benefit. Right now I don't see the benefit.

 

Nh2 can't go to g4 if h5 is played. It could further retreat to f1, but then what? If d2 was the destination then it could have just gone there. Is the idea Ng3?

 

"but cuts off the d-file for white's rook for a bit."

The intent is NOT to leave it there. The intent is to go to the queenside as previously stated, Nb3 for example which has a future on d4 or c5 later on. It's not "tucked in the corner" on h2.

 

DrStrawlanaevahi

"That doesn't make sense to me. Even when I check my engine, Nh2 lists as the best move for some time."

 

I am not saying the above position doesn't show Nh2. I am saying OTHER games showed Nh2 didn't work out. So, I have avoided that because I don't see how to play Nh2 and make it work out. 

 

"The idea of Nh2 may not happen in the moment, but it's something to keep in mind if the knight ever wants to go there."

 

If Nh2 is a move for later, and we play Rd2 instead, I am not seeing Rad1 after that to double up.

DrStrawlanaevahi

I am not asking about other games, I am asking about this game.

 

1) If Nh2 works in this game, please show how it works.

2) If one or both rooks should be played instead, please show how they should be played.

DrStrawlanaevahi

After looking at it several times, I don't see the benefit of Nh2. The fight seems to be in the center and taking advantage of black's king in the center.

 

The confusion is in what to do with the rooks, again I don't see Rd2 and Rad1 being shown by Stockfish, but I do see it showing how to cause trouble in the center nonetheless. 

 

DrStrawlanaevahi

How about this idea. 

 

 

ArtNJ

Nh2 isn't an outpost.  The knight is either traveling to g4 or taking a longer route of h2, f1, and either bishop moves then e3, or g3, f5.  F5 can be traded off, and I'm not sure that is a helpful change to the pawn structure despite giving white a passed pawn, not sure.  I don't see the knight on g4 doing anything or being useful, so assume its one of the other two manuevers.

I think its fine to not think about a knight tour per se, BUT what else is there to do here?  Its normal that where there are no pawn breaks or weak squares to attack, we try to improve our pieces.  So maybe nd2, c4 (not sure its needed or advances the ball much) or nd2, ng3, nf5.

DrStrawlanaevahi

If c4 is to be played what do you do with the other knight which is on c3? Ne2 to meet Nf4 and then c4?

 

punter99

Nh2 prevents Bh5 giving White ugly doubled pawns. Later the knight can go to f1 - g3 - f5 or f1 - e3 - d5

DrStrawlanaevahi

Ahh!!!, and that is what I was trying to do with g4 in the game I played. LOL, I had the answer already.

DrStrawlanaevahi

Here is the game. Feel free to give any other comments.

 

punter99

g4 is not that bad but it definitely has a positional drawback: Black gets a nice square for his knight on f4. After g4 you can't drive it away with the pawn anymore.

That happened in the game and you took with the bishop. Now Black took back with the g-pawn gxf4 which is wrong. If he takes with the e-pawn, suddenly the diagonal of the Bg7 is open and it becomes a much better piece.

If you look at the position around move 19, the Bg7 is Black's worst piece, stuck behind all the black pawns on dark squares. Black has a hard time to make use of the bishop as long as his pawn are on e5 and d6.

So in that sense g4 is a slight mistake because it helps Black to improve his pieces. Either you have to live with an annoying Nf4 constantly attacking your h3 pawn or you take the knight but that activates his bishop after exf4.