Americans suck at chess...why?

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modestmouse_
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zjm0374

We suck at chess cuz we busy beatin everyone's azz in da game of life...

Casual_Joe

The same reason we suck at soccer.  It's just not as popular here as other places.

Casual_Joe

...and cricket, badmitton, mao-zhong, etc.

Fear_ItseIf
zjm0374 wrote:

We suck at chess cuz we busy beatin everyone's azz in da game of life...

haha, classic example of american attitude. Whether intended or not, I loved it.

zackp93

I like how everyone goes, "oh they were born here but they were Jews." So you're telling me they aren't Americans if they are Jews or something else? I was not aware Americans were only white Christians.

winerkleiner

We need to work to pay for our taxes, etc.  We pay high and work hard, we don't have time for hobbies. 

APawnCanDream

I think a lot of it has to do with culture. Certain countries have systems, whether educational or otherwise, that facilitate a culture more encouraging of chess mastery. Also some claim its similar to why the United States has fallen behind in math and science over the past few decades- video games. ;)

ChessSponge

Well for starters the U.S. is a melting pot of immigrants so I don't think it neccessarily matters where someone is born. However, if you want to look at it like that, it is simply because chess isn't part of the culture.

The U.S. is bigger into physical sports and does very well at them (tends to be one of the medal count leaders in most olympics). We're also a huge nation in the financial, invention, innovation areas.

It just hasn't ever become a big focus in America. I don't think any one nation has to be good at everything out there that exists. It is perfectly fine for cultures to have different interests.

 

You could likewise ask why <insert any one of likely over 100 nations here> is not good at GO.

Fear_ItseIf
winerkleiner wrote:

We need to work to pay for our taxes, etc.  We pay high and work hard, we don't have time for hobbies. 

USA...the only country with taxes?

I'd attribute it to the bad education system, I believe it ranks near the bottom of all first world countries. Now, I dont just mean people's education in maths and science etc but also their education in the importance  and respect of things other people do, ie chess. This lack of education results in chess  and other things taking a backseat to sports.

Chess is also held in lower regard here in Australia, but it doesnt seem to be even fractionally as bad as it seems to be in the US.

Mandy711

Why should Americans excel at chess? They are excelling already in basketball, baseball and football where there is good money to earn. If super GMs could earn millions of dollars, I'm sure many Americans would be in the top 50. 

winerkleiner

Property taxes alone here are horrible, and I'm just on a personal rant and I don't mean to pollute your thread, other might agree with me or not (concerning taxes).

zjm0374

Fear.. Korea wouldn't even exist without u.s. tax dollars. Remember that...

mauriciolopezsr

Unfortunately we are a profits oriented country and Chess is NOT very popular mainly because is NOT fun to watch someone inmerse himself in a deep 20 or 30 minutes deep thought to make a move; it is a lot more fun to watch Lebron dunk a ball in the basket.

To "put the icing on the cake": Our school system under estimate the value of Chess playing for children and its impact on his class scores and ability to visualize and understand abstract math & physics concepts.

Until that is changed we will continue to perform poorly.

Ziryab

Americans pay among the lowest taxes in the world. We prefer physical sports and generally look down upon "intellectuals". Chess suffers from our anti-intellectualism. Consider that when a news broadcaster mentions chess, the self-reflective "it is too complicated for me" or "I don't have the patience" is almost obligatory.

Psalm25

Historically speaking, I think Soviet chess players were supported by their government and could devote all of their time to chess. Don't think that was the case with Americans when the Russians were dominant. Also think chess was a part of every Russian child's life and those that demonstrated a talent or knack for the game were singled out for further attention. Chess is not a part of every kid's life in America though a lot of schools have clubs. Some scholastic players in America are really good, though. But all of that, if right, is in the distant past anyway

Fear_ItseIf
zjm0374 wrote:

Fear.. Korea wouldn't even exist without u.s. tax dollars. Remember that...

Im from Australia though.

NimzoRoy
modestmouse_ wrote:

It seems to me there have only been a handful of American chess champions, and although they may have been born in the US they were Jewish, Asian, Indian or Slavic. Id like to see a John Smith at the top of he rankings, will this ever happen? Sure there are good players, but overall pretty lame. Why why why....whatsayyou???

It seems to me you don't know what you're talking about in addition to being a tad bit racist, hopefully unintentionally. Is there a difference between native-born WASP Americans and native-born Jews, Asians, and Indians? If so, please describe it. 

Lets see - Morphy, Paulsen, Showalter, Pillsbury, Marshall, Steinitz (a naturalized US citizen when he became the first official WCH), Evans, Reshevsky, Bisguier, Benko, Fischer, Fine, Kashdan, Christiansen, Browne, R Byrne, Denker, Nakamura, Kamsky, Alexander Onischuk (who is a member here BTW) etc etc. How many "American chess champions" (ie world-class players) past and present can you name? (BTW I know several GMs here aren't "native born" US citizens but they all played or play as US chess players now)

BTW the USA has won 5 Gold Chess Olympic medals (1st place) 5 Silver (2nd Place) and 9 Bronze medals (3rd place) out of 43 Chess OLs to date: 19 medals out of 129 total.  Not bad for a nation that "sucks at chess" huh?

Country rank by average rating of top 10 players
  Average GMs IMs Total Titled
1 Russia 2746 216 500 2175
2 Ukraine 2702 80 197 493
3 China 2670 31 26 125
4 France 2663 47 94 356
5 Armenia 2663 34 25 95
6 Hungary 2661 52 108 420
7 United States of America 2655 77 120 579

The entire list has 134 nations, and 33 nations have less than ten "Total Titled" players  http://ratings.fide.com/topfed.phtml

rooperi
Mandy711 wrote:

Why should Americans excel at chess? They are excelling already in basketball, baseball and football where there is good money to earn. If super GMs could earn millions of dollars, I'm sure many Americans would be in the top 50. 

And South Africans excel at Jukskei. the fact that no-one else plays doesn't bother us at all.

Seraphimity

I agree with the anti-intellectualism statements being a chess champ is not going to win you big prestige unless you are #1.  Anything other then being the best Im affraid would relegate you the ranks of just another Chess Champion.  

If I was to guess at why American's rank lower, Im taking the OP at face value.. I'd guess that for the base investment in time a person in America can make money alot quicker and easier somewhere else.  Texas Holdem.. Understanding of Number theory and being able to assess probabilities are usefull tools.  The investment and dedication to chess are probably what sets the US lower.   Also, I don't imagine Carlsen would have much luck at the park getting a money game going ;) If I was number one I think I'd keep it under my hat for a minute and go for a big upset somewhere amid much speculation of cheating and murmers of the London system not being a viable opening choice at top level play, LOL  

I can also think of boy from my neihborhood born of good means and likely very bright who hated his father for making him swing a baseball bat for 6 hours a day.  He did become a major league player and his families name is on a quite few car dealerships and real estate trusts.  Not many endorsements for chess players.  So someone with the gifts and the means minus the Fischer Genius with Chess are going to have really work to set themselves apart in the Chess universe.