can we just take a step back about Naroditsky? - Chess Forums - Page 3

marqumax · 2025-10-27T04:24:47-07:00

We’re all very sad about his death, but I don’t think we should blame people like Kramnik so much, Daniel became a public figure online. He knew what he signed up for, criticism, hate and false accusations. If he had a particularly fragile personality he shouldn’t have put himself in such a vulnerab

ImweirdinAT

2 days ago

0

#41

BlackholeExpert2021 hat geschrieben:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

I do think his intent was to cause harm in that sense, im sure he didnt want death, but he wanted very harsh consequences. Im sure kramnik doesnt have 100% fault, i think its also Fide CEOs fault and some other for not stopping these allegations.

ImweirdinAT

2 days ago

0

#42

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

BlackholeExpert2021 wrote:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Thats called "not wanting to see the evidence"

AirFighter14

2 days ago

0

#43

ImweirdinAT wrote:

That logic is flawed, you stated in the previous thread kramnik shouldnt be harassed, yet this is contradictory by saying he SHOULD be harassed

There's nothing contradictory. Stop jumping to conclusions.

NoemiS05

2 days ago

0

#44

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

BlackholeExpert2021 wrote:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Thats called "not wanting to see the evidence"

Okay, post here please.

AirFighter14

2 days ago

0

#45

NoemiS05 wrote:

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Good point. Most people are just parroting talking points.

lostpawn247

2 days ago

0

#46

NoemiS05 wrote:

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

BlackholeExpert2021 wrote:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Thats called "not wanting to see the evidence"

Okay, post here please.

We don't work for free.

NoemiS05

2 days ago

0

#47

lostpawn247 wrote:

NoemiS05 wrote:

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

BlackholeExpert2021 wrote:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Thats called "not wanting to see the evidence"

Okay, post here please.

We don't work for free.

Post a link then, please? Can you honestly say that you have ever seen any evidence of Vladimir Kramnik cyberbullying anyone, rather than just accusing people of cheating?

ImweirdinAT

2 days ago

0

#48

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

lostpawn247 wrote:

NoemiS05 wrote:

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

BlackholeExpert2021 wrote:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Thats called "not wanting to see the evidence"

Okay, post here please.

We don't work for free.

Post a link then, please? Can you honestly say that you have ever seen any evidence of Vladimir Kramnik cyberbullying anyone, rather than just accusing people of cheating?

Google "You thought i was gone? Speedrun return"

"Justice for Daniel naroditsky" and i forgot the name of the Hikaru video so just look st his most recent videos and pick the one bout Naroditsky

ImweirdinAT

2 days ago

0

#49

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

BlackholeExpert2021 wrote:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Thats called "not wanting to see the evidence"

Okay, post here please.

Disprove me with your "evidence" of which you said "I might be wrong":If kramnik had never publicly accused Danya he would still be alive

NoemiS05

2 days ago

0

#50

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

lostpawn247 wrote:

NoemiS05 wrote:

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

BlackholeExpert2021 wrote:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Thats called "not wanting to see the evidence"

Okay, post here please.

We don't work for free.

Post a link then, please? Can you honestly say that you have ever seen any evidence of Vladimir Kramnik cyberbullying anyone, rather than just accusing people of cheating?

Google "You thought i was gone? Speedrun return"

"Justice for Daniel naroditsky" and i forgot the name of the Hikaru video so just look st his most recent videos and pick the one bout Naroditsky

I've seen them. Everyone has. Is this really all there is? Hikaru was one of Danya's close friends. There's nothing in them about actual cyberbullying, only cheating allegations and how it made Danya feel.

lostpawn247

2 days ago

0

#51

NoemiS05 wrote:

lostpawn247 wrote:

NoemiS05 wrote:

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

BlackholeExpert2021 wrote:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Thats called "not wanting to see the evidence"

Okay, post here please.

We don't work for free.

Post a link then, please? Can you honestly say that you have ever seen any evidence of Vladimir Kramnik cyberbullying anyone, rather than just accusing people of cheating?

I don't work for free.

NoemiS05

2 days ago

0

#52

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

BlackholeExpert2021 wrote:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Thats called "not wanting to see the evidence"

Okay, post here please.

Disprove me with your "evidence" of which you said "I might be wrong":If kramnik had never publicly accused Danya he would still be alive

So Kramnik, one of the most outspoken critics of online cheating in chess, should have just not said anything about a major chess GM streamer who was literally caught breaking Fair Play rules and admitted it? What?

Cythaera

2 days ago

0

#53

NoemiS05 said "Also, the modern attention span is falling, and the thought of watching a 30-40 minute video without any cinematic cuts or explosions to find out what a person really thinks is terrifying to most people. Much easier to just call him crazy and his claims unfounded, set him on fire and remove his championship titles."

so true. One person in a hundred watched Mr Naroditsky's last stream. Many said that after minute 35 it is too disturbing, too distressing.

(I've watched the whole thing. Don't quite get what triggered so many.)

But everyone-- repeat, everyone-- has an opinion on it.

ImweirdinAT

2 days ago

0

#54

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

lostpawn247 wrote:

NoemiS05 wrote:

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

BlackholeExpert2021 wrote:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Thats called "not wanting to see the evidence"

Okay, post here please.

We don't work for free.

Post a link then, please? Can you honestly say that you have ever seen any evidence of Vladimir Kramnik cyberbullying anyone, rather than just accusing people of cheating?

Google "You thought i was gone? Speedrun return"

"Justice for Daniel naroditsky" and i forgot the name of the Hikaru video so just look st his most recent videos and pick the one bout Naroditsky

I've seen them. Everyone has. Is this really all there is? Hikaru was one of Danya's close friends. There's nothing in them about actual cyberbullying, only cheating allegations and how it made Danya feel.

You keep bringing up cyber bullying, define it! You wanna throw around a term like that yet you dont really know its meaning, also #2 i think the mental distress caused by defamation is much bigger. Please watch the final Danya stream and then try arguing with me, you dont even feel sorry for him, all you care abt is kramniks reputation, not the life that was lost

Cythaera

2 days ago

0

#55

These people don't work for free.

But they dole out their opinions like pennycandy.

ImweirdinAT

2 days ago

0

#56

Cythaera hat geschrieben:

These people don't work for free.
But they dole out their opinions like pennycandy.

So basically we both are the same except for the fact you work for free? Thats kinda dumb

Cythaera

2 days ago

0

#57

surprised this isn't locked yet.

Mods locked the last thread soon after I posted the inconvenient truth that Naroditsky was ejected from Titled Tuesday competitions.

Coincidence or causative? Let's find out, shall we?

ImweirdinAT

2 days ago

0

#58

Cythaera hat geschrieben:

surprised this isn't locked yet.
Mods locked the last thread soon after I posted the inconvenient truth that Naroditsky was ejected from Titled Tuesday competitions.
Coincidence or causative? Let's find out, shall we?

You bring claims, please show me any proof this is true

NoemiS05

2 days ago

0

#59

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

lostpawn247 wrote:

NoemiS05 wrote:

ImweirdinAT wrote:

NoemiS05 hat geschrieben:

BlackholeExpert2021 wrote:

If we are looking at this from a civil court case perspective I think while Kramnik could share some fault for hurting Danya's well being and driving him to suicide (intentional tort perhaps? Or maybe libel defamation?) It would never reach a preponderance of evidence (51% in fault of Kramnik) in my opinion because while cyber harassment is serious I don't think that alone is enough? It would also need to show that the harassment was driven with intent to cause harm and was prevalent enough. Not entirely sure, thoughts?

But where is all this supposed evidence of cyberbullying? Have you seen any? The whole of these forums and X and YouTube seem to be filled with accusations of murder and bullying etc against Kramnik - but, out of 6 or 7 full thread, and a whole bunch of YouTube comments on various videos, and a couple of Reddit threads, I haven't seen one single piece of evidence for Kramnik doing this. None whatever. It's strange.

Thats called "not wanting to see the evidence"

Okay, post here please.

We don't work for free.

Post a link then, please? Can you honestly say that you have ever seen any evidence of Vladimir Kramnik cyberbullying anyone, rather than just accusing people of cheating?

Google "You thought i was gone? Speedrun return"

"Justice for Daniel naroditsky" and i forgot the name of the Hikaru video so just look st his most recent videos and pick the one bout Naroditsky

I've seen them. Everyone has. Is this really all there is? Hikaru was one of Danya's close friends. There's nothing in them about actual cyberbullying, only cheating allegations and how it made Danya feel.

You keep bringing up cyber bullying, define it! You wanna throw around a term like that yet you dont really know its meaning, also #2 i think the mental distress caused by defamation is much bigger. Please watch the final Danya stream and then try arguing with me, you dont even feel sorry for him, all you care abt is kramniks reputation, not the life that was lost

I was a fan of both. Danya was a brilliant teacher, YouTuber and chess commentator. Kramnik is one of the top 10 greatest chess players of all time. You don't have to hate one to be a fan of the other. But nobody is hating on Danya right now, he's at peace - it's all being aimed at Kramnik, seemingly without reason. I've watched Danya's stream a couple of times now (a version with and without chat) - I don't see how it's relevant (perceived harassment is not the same thing as actual harassment, especially if he was feeling depressed). As he said in the stream, it wasn't just Kramnik who suspected him of cheating, but Nepo and others as well.

WongEthanLY

2 days ago

0

#60

rq im gonna unfollow this because this thread was just a test from my settings