Ethics...

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Tricklev

Depends, online or otb? If someone spoke to me otb I would have shushed them and possibly called the arbitrator if he kept at it, online I can't say I really care.

Nytik

Funny, the exact thing happened to me when I had just started chess, perhaps over 1.5 years ago now. The school champion placed a piece en-prise, and heaved a sigh. (A face-palm moment, if you will.) Of course, I immediately captured the piece. Two or three seconds later, I had a 0 next to my name and I was out of the School Knockout tournament. (The following year, my crafty opponent had left the school, I was much stronger, and went on to win both that and the School Championship as well.)

But on other areas of psychology... I find the best way to win is to flash 'Hang Queen' multiple times in the blink of an eye, and just allow my opponents AWP to take over. Cool

Lord-Chaos
Nytik wrote:

Funny, the exact thing happened to me when I had just started chess, perhaps over 1.5 years ago now. The school champion placed a piece en-prise, and heaved a sigh. (A face-palm moment, if you will.) Of course, I immediately captured the piece. Two or three seconds later, I had a 0 next to my name and I was out of the School Knockout tournament. *face-palm*


Have any of you ever tried shaking your head repeatedly after a move, and sighing? I was like 12 years old playing against adults, and i was like "sigh" once, then twice, buried my head in my arms. Course it doesn't work, but it makes the opponent think something... Maybe if I take a twist on those skills, i could use psychology on em =D

WildFireMayhem

That seems ok to me Devout_Monk.  I use those kind of tactics all the time.  It adds another dimension to the game if you ask me.  Your opponent would only have himself to blame for not concentrating on the position.

check2008
KyleJRM wrote:

Let's see, when faced with a contrary opinion, Check2008:

1) Makes it personal, attacking the person with the contrary opinion rather than the opinion itself, i.e. the logical fallacy of ad hominem

2) Gets into a e-peen comparison contest about ratings, i.e. the logical fallacy of appeal to false authority

3) Grossly exaggerates what I said and makes up hypothetical situations that do not exist and generally lies by putting words into my mouth, i.e. the classic strawman fallacy

Yeah, I'd say that my assessment that such tactics are reserved for juvenile people has been pretty much supported by your post.  Without looking, I'm guessing late high school or early college. Certainly pre-Intro to Philosophy, where they would have taught you the basic logical fallacies to avoid. 


Indeed, I'm a college freshmen, but no pre-Intro to Philosophy, but a double major with mathematics and computer sciences. I apologize, I wasn't thinking when I made that post last night. I was rude when I shouldn't have been. I still support my initial view of "trash-talking" your opponent being ok and part of the game, but I shouldn't have reinforced my views in that manner.

Dakota_Clark
Tricklev wrote:

Depends, online or otb? If someone spoke to me otb I would have shushed them and possibly called the arbitrator if he kept at it, online I can't say I really care.


Isn't there actually any rules about talking with the opponent?!?! That's ridiculous, if so.

Dakota_Clark
WildFireMayhem wrote:

That seems ok to me Devout_Monk.  I use those kind of tactics all the time.  It adds another dimension to the game if you ask me.  Your opponent would only have himself to blame for not concentrating on the position.


Precisely!

Syntax_error

So the justification for underhanded mental tactics in chess is that it is a mental game? So in water polo since it is a physical game it makes it all right to kick and punch people under the water?

Bardu

I have never tried any tactics like that, and wouldn't. I would rather win the game on the board.

check2008
Syntax_error wrote:

So the justification for underhanded mental tactics in chess is that it is a mental game? So in water polo since it is a physical game it makes it all right to kick and punch people under the water?


Is kicking and punching people under the water in water polo allowed? I don't think so. Are "underhanded mental tactics" in chess allowed? I think so.

guitardog

Its the kind of thing my nephew does. He is 7. If someone did it to me in a real game, and they were an adult, I would have genuine concerns for their emotional, never mind spiritual, development. Do you remember Boss Hog in the Dukes of Hazzard? He is the kind of guy I imagine doing this kind of thing. Sure its all part of the game if you are into that kind fo thing, but it is kind of obvious, no?  Psychology for dullards. Bring on the real mind games. ( ;

Kupov
brusselsshrek wrote:

Wasn't Karpov accused of trying to distract Kasparov through slow play?


That would be pretty funny.

tineslabbinck

You mean something like this?

Kupov
Suggo wrote:

Nothing wrong with any of the stuff said here from what I can see. 

Amazing the number of oh so sensitive people here. 


Online or OTB? You can turn off chat and what not so it's not a big deal in online chess, but if someone started talking to me during an OTB game I would be very annoyed.

silvergnak

I find most of the "psychological tactics" explained in this thread pretty low. For me the goal of the true chess player is to win using legal moves as defined by the rules of the game. Would you call the stupidity that went on in the Topalov-Kramnik match "great chess play"? It sure had an effect on the psychology of the players, and it may have been planned by one of the party involved to mentally unsettle the opponent.

Also, about the comparison with bluffing in chess: surely the good bluffer needs to be a bit of an actor, however the most important part of it is in-game, that is, the opponents will only fall for it if the bluffer plays as if they had a good hand. Something similar is possible in chess, and it has nothing to do with lying to the opponent. It actually consists in playing inferior moves to make the opponent over confident, force them to play in a style they don't like, or any other purpose. Supposedly Lasker had a lot of success with this approach. Though I'm with Fischer on this one ("I don't believe in psychology, only good moves"), I don't see anything wrong with it.

Snail
silvergnak wrote:

For me the goal of the true chess player is to win using legal moves as defined by the rules of the game.


As already stated, it is not against the rules ;)

I still agree with you though...

PrawnEatsPrawn

Basic Site Rules

Put simply: be nice, no cheating!

Chess.com is a friendly community for those who love chess! Please be on your best behavior as you play chess and interact with others. Failure to follow these rules will result in your account being closed.

 

 That is one myth busted then. First paragraph of the Site Rules, which can be found at:

 

http://www.chess.com/legal.html

jpd303

i think fischer used psychological tricks even if he didnt consciously realize he was, such as his antics in the world championship vs spassky.  on the dick cavet show he said the favorite part of a chess game was when he crushed the other guys ego.  ego is psychology, if you crush the ego you inflict damage on the mind.fischer was in many ways a walking talking contradiction- and anti-semetic half jew, a great man and a very petty man, the source of pride and embarrassment to america, a man who revered chess as almost a god but who tried to destroy the game with his own version (can you imagine the ego of someone who worshiped something so much they devoted thier every waking hour to it only to later believe that they could improve on perfection). anyway, use any tool you have at your disposal is what i think.  ive done the opposite before too, i was playing a friend whos rated like 400 points below me and saw that he had a great combo coming, i thought he might miss it so i left him the cryptic message "if im not careful you might find a way to win this game..." he said that he looked extra hard to find the right move because of my message and ended up winning the game!   

Suggo
PrawnEatsPrawn wrote:
Basic Site Rules

Put simply: be nice, no cheating!

Chess.com is a friendly community for those who love chess! Please be on your best behavoir as you play chess and interact with others. Failure to follow these rules will result in your account being closed.

 

 That is one myth busted then. First paragraph of the Site Rules, which can be found at:

 

http://www.chess.com/legal.html


What myth is that?

Are you seriously trying to claim that making comments during the game is against the rules?

KyleJRM
check2008 wrote:
KyleJRM wrote:

Let's see, when faced with a contrary opinion, Check2008:

1) Makes it personal, attacking the person with the contrary opinion rather than the opinion itself, i.e. the logical fallacy of ad hominem

2) Gets into a e-peen comparison contest about ratings, i.e. the logical fallacy of appeal to false authority

3) Grossly exaggerates what I said and makes up hypothetical situations that do not exist and generally lies by putting words into my mouth, i.e. the classic strawman fallacy

Yeah, I'd say that my assessment that such tactics are reserved for juvenile people has been pretty much supported by your post.  Without looking, I'm guessing late high school or early college. Certainly pre-Intro to Philosophy, where they would have taught you the basic logical fallacies to avoid. 


Indeed, I'm a college freshmen, but no pre-Intro to Philosophy, but a double major with mathematics and computer sciences. I apologize, I wasn't thinking when I made that post last night. I was rude when I shouldn't have been. I still support my initial view of "trash-talking" your opponent being ok and part of the game, but I shouldn't have reinforced my views in that manner.


Apology accepted and I apologize for getting a bit personal in my reply.

 

I also think that the seriousness of the game matters.  If it's the World Championship, some players feel that a certain amount of gamesmanship is important.  I won't be playing for the World Championship anytime soon, and I consider my games to be friendly for the most part.  I usually just censor and noplay opponents who talk trash.

I think it gets down to the ideals of chess.  Poker is supposed to be a game of incomplete information, that is one of its defining characteristics.  Chess is supposed to be a game of complete information, where everything relevant to the game at hand is visible to all players at all times.