How can bobby fischer's cognition and intelligence be so high if he suffered from schizophrenia?

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Schizophrenia is neurodegenerative and impairs cognition heavily, many who are diagnosed have low IQ. It is wild to both have this condition and be a top tier chess player and score 180 on IQ test. How is it possible?

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whoa big words

Avatar of closedmn
Shark_Tom_555 wrote:

whoa big words

For you, yes.

Avatar of JohnNapierSanDiego

Well, Nikola Tesla suffered similar problems...  It happens.  There are always exceptions.

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JohnNapierSanDiego wrote:

Well, Nikola Tesla suffered similar problems...  It happens.  There are always exceptions.

Same to Unabomber, aka. Ted Kaczynski, measured 167 IQ PhD math professor, paranoid schizophrenia diagnosed. Do you see the pattern?

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luvm00n wrote:

It is wild to both have this condition and be a top tier chess player and score 180 on IQ test. How is it possible?

Because Fischer never scored 180 on an IQ test.

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Schizophrenia isn't neuro degenerative in the conventional sense - perhaps it can be shown that the parts of cognition that relate to social function can degrade overtime, I am not sure how one could quantify that as easily as one wold say quantify the decline with Alzheimers.

John Nash, who I would put about 7 or 8 levels above Bobby Fischer had very profound schizophrenia and yet produce paradigm shifting work in mathematics. Bobby Fischer could play a board game, John Nash could redefine how the entire world interacted with numbers.

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@1

"He definitely was not schizophrenic" said psychiatrist Magnús Skúlason, who discussed with Fischer in Iceland.

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@6
Yes, Fischer scored 180 on an IQ test
Brady, Frank (2011). Endgame: Bobby Fischer's Remarkable Rise and Fall – from America's Brightest Prodigy to the Edge of Madness (1st ed.). Crown. ISBN 978-0-307-46390-6.

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He's HIM

Avatar of Wits-end

Just because a few of us have been writing our Manifestos doesn’t mean we’re crazy!

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TheNameofNames wrote:

People over sensationalize his "downfall" all that happened was he got old and was thinking about his death, and got tired of chess. Its really simple, people want to make the guy out to be some crazy recluse for some reason. He cleary just got bored and old.

Have you read the transcript of his radio interview with the Philippine radio station?

He very clearly had bigger problems than "bored and old".

Avatar of Optimissed


In any case, schizophrenia was invented by American psychiatrists, during or just after one of the major wars, to diagnose and categorise some of those who had mentally succumbed to the effects of warfare. It is used to characterise a range of symptoms and there's confusion about whether some forms of schizophrenia really exist. One of the main symptoms is taken to be audio hallucinations, from which many diagnoses of schizophrenia have been made. Yet audio hallucinations themselves are not dangerous and are perfectly normal in a minority of people, indicating a slight difference in how unconscious thoughts are perceived. They only become dangerous when negative and harmful suggestions are acted upon. However, they are capable of causing some people great distress, when they are told by psychiatrists that they mean schizophrenia and so in that way, schizophrenia, as well as having been invented is also created, to a large extent, by psychiatrists.

This comes from extensive talks with my wife, around eight or ten years ago. She is a fully trained mental nurse (RMN) with an MSc in psychology and she is also a very highly qualified psychotherapist.

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blueemu wrote:
TheNameofNames wrote:

People over sensationalize his "downfall" all that happened was he got old and was thinking about his death, and got tired of chess. Its really simple, people want to make the guy out to be some crazy recluse for some reason. He cleary just got bored and old.

Have you read the transcript of his radio interview with the Philippine radio station?

He very clearly had bigger problems than "bored and old".

Is there a link to this?

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tygxc wrote:

@6
Yes, Fischer scored 180 on an IQ test
Brady, Frank (2011). Endgame: Bobby Fischer's Remarkable Rise and Fall – from America's Brightest Prodigy to the Edge of Madness (1st ed.). Crown. ISBN 978-0-307-46390-6.

Or, rather, after Fischer had become a famous chess player, someone assessed his IQ as having been 180. If he hadn’t become a famous chess player I guess no one would have bothered making up such a number…

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@18
That was in 1952, when Fischer was 9 years old.
He was tested because he had problems with schools.

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I think it's some form of savantism

Savant syndrome is where a person who is intellectually lacking in one or more fields is prodigous in certain fields. 

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cap78red wrote:

just joking btw. i am schizophrenic and have a high iq, how i would describe schizophrenia is as the mind being bound by its own ideas and if people recognise it themselves that are doing the binding they can 'cure' themselves of it, it is actually over thinking not under thinking.

Yes but I think that if you're prescribed drugs, they will dull down your ability to cure yourself. It's perfectly possible to cure yourself of scizophrenia I suppose until irreversible physical changes occur in your mind due to the delusions gaining a firmer hold and effectively killing normal cognitive responses.

Do you have a comment to make on that? I'm not qualified in any way on this subject but I'm very good at it. evil

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Wits-end wrote:

Just because a few of us have been writing our Manifestos doesn’t mean we’re crazy!


Zo, I have already ze things I will do in a list, ven I take over ze vorld. Fistly I vil ban some flavours of icecream and also I vil ban garlic. Anyone making garlic flavoured icecream shall be mercilessly exterminated.

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TheNameofNames wrote:

Every genius has a high tendency to go crazy because that is what pattern-seeking does for example the other guy posted an ambiguous comment, and I'm wondering if it pertains to me because I'm a pattern-seeking mammal after retiring in chess the brain is in pattern-seeking mode, and the needs have to be filled

absolutely