Increasing Positional Skills through Classical

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ninjaswat

So I played a 2000 USCF in some 10|0 rapid and lost utterly, I feel like I need to get better at openings, and most importantly positional play. What methods can I use to differentiate between candidate moves and become more of a positional player? Thanks in advance.

Not really looking to use books, since personally those don't help that much. My tactics seem to be up to speed though...

sndeww

do you play e4 or d4? maybe try switching around your repertoire.

ninjaswat
MrDubious67 wrote:

What's your repertoire? That's gonna majorly impact whether you play positionally or otherwise. 

For white, c4 is what I'm usually playing now, former e4/d4 player... played both as a "main" opening. I'll transpose into a Catalan (usually open) or QG at times.

For black, I usually play c5 vs both e4 and d4, and then e6 d5 vs c4. Against Nf3 setups I copy.

ninjaswat
B1ZMARK wrote:

do you play e4 or d4? maybe try switching around your repertoire.

c4, switched pretty recently.

Used to play e4 before that, then d4 before that, then e4 before that...

OrphanGenerator

My coach has a really good l*chess study that helped me with that (might not work for you due to the rating difference) but unfortunately its blocked, i can try getting a copy of it somehow

sndeww

well first off my opinion on positional play is that you can't really get a good hang of it without books. Because positional play is better off being written down instead of through calculation, it's largely based off of principles of blockading, prophylaxis, over-protection, etc.

But it's also strategic as well, and a lot of the times there are nuances from structures that you can only either find in books, or through a private coach. And nobody can guarantee that your coach is actually able to dissect the positions as thoroughly as those who are writing books. You'll largely have to make do with a hodgepodge of youtube videos and pick up information bits wherever you can.

Because I can't help you really, since each position demands different things. And I'm sure you're already aware of the generalizations, like "trade when you have less space" and stuff.

blueemu
ninjaswat wrote:

What methods can I use to differentiate between candidate moves and become more of a positional player?

GM Larry Evans outlines a method:

GM Larry Evans' method of static analysis - Chess Forums - Chess.com

ninjaswat
B1ZMARK wrote:

well first off my opinion on positional play is that you can't really get a good hang of it without books. Because positional play is better off being written down instead of through calculation, it's largely based off of principles of blockading, prophylaxis, over-protection, etc.

I understand your point... hmmm... I guess I'll have to read a few then lol.

B1ZMARK wrote:

But it's also strategic as well, and a lot of the times there are nuances from structures that you can only either find in books, or through a private coach. And nobody can guarantee that your coach is actually able to dissect the positions as thoroughly as those who are writing books. You'll largely have to make do with a hodgepodge of youtube videos and pick up information bits wherever you can.

Okay, makes sense, I guess I'll watch quite a few videos when I'm doing nothing.

B1ZMARK wrote:

Because I can't help you really, since each position demands different things. And I'm sure you're already aware of the generalizations, like "trade when you have less space" and stuff.

True, I do know, I believe, most of those happy.png

Thanks for the ideas anyway.

ninjaswat
blueemu wrote:
ninjaswat wrote:

What methods can I use to differentiate between candidate moves and become more of a positional player?

GM Larry Evans outlines a method:

GM Larry Evans' method of static analysis - Chess Forums - Chess.com

Ah, forgot about that. I'll try it in some 30|0 games maybe when I have time.

ninjaswat
OrphanGenerator wrote:

My coach has a really good l*chess study that helped me with that (might not work for you due to the rating difference) but unfortunately its blocked, i can try getting a copy of it somehow

Haha I'm not talking about simple concepts but the sort of stuff that would differentiate me from a 2000 USCF. Seems interesting, can you send me a copy if you find it?

OrphanGenerator
ninjaswat wrote:
OrphanGenerator wrote:

My coach has a really good l*chess study that helped me with that (might not work for you due to the rating difference) but unfortunately its blocked, i can try getting a copy of it somehow

Haha I'm not talking about simple concepts but the sort of stuff that would differentiate me from a 2000 USCF. Seems interesting, can you send me a copy if you find it?

One second

OrphanGenerator

I can't get it for you because every possible method doesn't work, sorry

ninjaswat
OrphanGenerator wrote:

I can't get it for you because every possible method doesn't work, sorry

That's fine maybe ask your coach next time you see them.

Lightning

Why do you need to become more of a positional player tho? It might make more sense to alter your opening repertoire, go for more tactical positions and win like that, and just play to your strengths.

In any case, if you want to improve positional play I'd advise you to keep playing these rapid games and analyze them deeply. Figure out where you went wrong, find the best move, and try to see why it's the best move. It's just like with tactics where it's all patterns, the more you see it the more you get used to it and pick up on it. Positional chess has concepts that need to be known (B1Z  named some) and they can be learned by just studying your games and figuring out what went wrong. Not just your games, actually, you could check out some GM games, too, that's always helpful. This is what my coach does with me every lesson I have with him, once a week, and that's helped me quite a lot over the years

If you don't have a coach and don't want one, It could benefit you to find a study partner as well to play and analyze games with you

krazeechess

Well, books are the primary way to improve at these things, since positional play is full of concepts and principles. Do you have a coach?

krazeechess
Lightning wrote:

Why do you need to become more of a positional player tho? It might make more sense to alter your opening repertoire, go for more tactical positions and win like that, and just play to your strengths.

In any case, if you want to improve positional play I'd advise you to keep playing these rapid games and analyze them deeply. Figure out where you went wrong, find the best move, and try to see why it's the best move. It's just like with tactics where it's all patterns, the more you see it the more you get used to it and pick up on it. Positional chess has concepts that need to be known (B1Z  named some) and they can be learned by just studying your games and figuring out what went wrong. Not just your games, actually, you could check out some GM games, too, that's always helpful. This is what my coach does with me every lesson I have with him, once a week, and that's helped me quite a lot over the years

If you don't have a coach and don't want one, It could benefit you to find a study partner as well to play and analyze games with you

If you want to be good at chess, you need positional play. Even in tactical openings, you need positional play to get into positions that have tactics in them. Plus, there is almost always a line that avoids an attacking/tactical position in those type of openings and you need to be prepared for those.

Lightning
krazeechess wrote:
Lightning wrote:

Why do you need to become more of a positional player tho? It might make more sense to alter your opening repertoire, go for more tactical positions and win like that, and just play to your strengths.

In any case, if you want to improve positional play I'd advise you to keep playing these rapid games and analyze them deeply. Figure out where you went wrong, find the best move, and try to see why it's the best move. It's just like with tactics where it's all patterns, the more you see it the more you get used to it and pick up on it. Positional chess has concepts that need to be known (B1Z  named some) and they can be learned by just studying your games and figuring out what went wrong. Not just your games, actually, you could check out some GM games, too, that's always helpful. This is what my coach does with me every lesson I have with him, once a week, and that's helped me quite a lot over the years

If you don't have a coach and don't want one, It could benefit you to find a study partner as well to play and analyze games with you

If you want to be good at chess, you need positional play. Even in tactical openings, you need positional play to get into positions that have tactics in them. Plus, there is almost always a line that avoids an attacking/tactical position in those type of openings and you need to be prepared for those.

You don't necessarily need good positional play to be good at chess but it is preferable. Positional play is only one aspect of the game.

blueemu
Lightning wrote:

Positional play is only one aspect of the game.

An essential aspect. So is tactics.

A bird flies erratically on one wing.

ninjaswat
Lightning wrote:

Why do you need to become more of a positional player tho? It might make more sense to alter your opening repertoire, go for more tactical positions and win like that, and just play to your strengths.

In any case, if you want to improve positional play I'd advise you to keep playing these rapid games and analyze them deeply. Figure out where you went wrong, find the best move, and try to see why it's the best move. It's just like with tactics where it's all patterns, the more you see it the more you get used to it and pick up on it. Positional chess has concepts that need to be known (B1Z  named some) and they can be learned by just studying your games and figuring out what went wrong. Not just your games, actually, you could check out some GM games, too, that's always helpful. This is what my coach does with me every lesson I have with him, once a week, and that's helped me quite a lot over the years

If you don't have a coach and don't want one, It could benefit you to find a study partner as well to play and analyze games with you

 - I need to be able to play positional games as I'm good at seeing tactics but don't prefer opposite sides castling positions and the like. My positional skills allow for me to get attacking games, but I feel like that is the next area for me to majorly improve.

- I'm starting to analyze every move in rapid games (with an engine) to see if there are any principles/maneuvers that I'm missing ingame that I wouldn't even find in classical.

I do have a coach but we focus more on other things as of right now, mostly what I need to do to get better tactically.

ninjaswat
krazeechess wrote:

Well, books are the primary way to improve at these things, since positional play is full of concepts and principles. Do you have a coach?

I have a coach. He helps me a bit but my improvement is primarily to my own direction.