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Is Chess on the verge of being solved?

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AndyClifton

So that's why Prawn left!

wrangler04

Chess will always be what it is, and was, the game of kings now the king of games

AndyClifton

And the prince of tides!

Elroch
blake78613 wrote:

We may be a long way from solving chess in the mathmatical sense, but in the practical sense, I don't think we are more than 50 years away from all most grandmaster games being draws.

Nonsense. Games between the very strongest class of players are more commonly decisive than those of weaker masters. While there is solid evidence that the standard of play is improving, there is no evidence for an increasing fraction of draws with this increase. This pattern is continued in computer chess (worth examining since the top computers are the strongest players of all, currently). Here, there are a lot of decisive games and no sign of a decrease in the number.

timlawson

With perfect play from both sides, checkers (we call it draughts) is a draw. Of course, chess has a hell of a lot more variations because pieces can move backwards, move differently and the rules are different from checkers. Not such an easy one to solve unless you apply a basic logical principal.

BOTH sides are able to make "waiting moves" in chess from many positions. Therefore, all else being equal (material) the game should be a draw with perfect play from both sides.

Although at the highest level there is a slight advantage to moving first, it is not enough of an advantage to prove decisive from the first move. Similarly, this also implies that white cannot be in zugswang. Result = drawn with best play from both sides. Though this has not been proven as yet, it will eventually be proven (perhaps even within my lifetime).

Processing technology does not seem to be showing any signs of slowing down. The good thing about the human brain is that the best players will still be able to draw with "best play". The reason for this is the sheer number of ways of achieving the same position in the ending. For example, a rook and pawn ending where one side has a total of 30 move options - even on tablebases, 10 moves might be dead level, 15 further moves might lead to a slight disadvantage and 5 moves might be considered losing moves.

It won't stop people playing the game.

ncpharaoh

I still stand by my opinion.

ivandh

Its been over 200 posts, have we solved it yet?

Ziryab

The King's Gambit has been solved.

madhacker
Ziryab wrote:

The King's Gambit has been solved.

It seems so, if this article is to be believed

http://chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=8047

It claims that the KG has been finally cracked by an insanely powerful computer running for four months. Its conclusion? That after 1. e4 e5 2. f4 exf4, both 3. Nf3 and 3. Bc4 are losing for white, and the only move for white to hold the draw is 3. Be2!

madhacker

Although come to think of it, the article is dated April 2nd, only a day after April Fools Day. It could be an April Fool.

magmuso

I give 99.999999% of an April fool's joke

By the way, a very intriguing one. 

DrSpudnik

Even if true, no human is going to sit there and recall from memory the trillion moves needed to prove it.

Morris_W3

I certainly hope chess will not be "solved".  It to me sounds something like "can women ever be understood?"  (apologies to female readers), but I feel like when I'm playing a game - a really good game - the end result is less important than the journey and the true enjoyment comes from each player in a give-and-tke situation and that's true whether the ratings involved are

2400> or 1200<.

RooksBailey

I can't help but to think this is the beginning of the end of traditional chess.  The computer scientist who solved the Kings Gambit has said that he is going to solve other openings as well.  While no player will be able to commit to memory every possible line of play for an OTB game, once the "solutions" are posted online - as the computer scientist said he is going to do - CC play is going to be ruined because people will just consult the file for each move. 

Looks like it is time to abandon traditional chess for Chess960.  Somewhere Fischer is smiling.

fburton

Don't worry, there's probably more chess left than oil!

Have we even reached "peak chess" yet? Undecided

madhacker

Chessbase just admitted it was an April fool

http://chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=8051

antioxidant
RooksBailey wrote:

I can't help but to think this is the beginning of the end of traditional chess.  The computer scientist who solved the Kings Gambit has said that he is going to solve other openings as well.  While no player will be able to commit to memory every possible line of play for an OTB game, once the "solutions" are posted online - as the computer scientist said he is going to do - CC play is going to be ruined because people will just consult the file for each move. 

Looks like it is time to abandon traditional chess for Chess960.  Somewhere Fischer is smiling.

antioxidant

thanks there is still chess 960 if we arrive at that moment in time where traditional chess is already database., where it will become obsolete.

AndyClifton
ncpharaoh wrote:

I still stand by my opinion.

Fortunately, I don't remember what it was.

TyrannusVerticalis

In the distant future, the computer capacity may exist to reduce all possible chess positions to a Nalimov table base analogue.

But our brains will never be able to retain all that data for OTB play.