Yeah, this one's nice and civil. Hardly seems like the chess.com I know and love.
Islam and chess
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Who can respect law enforcement where "gambling" is concerned ? I can't and do not. What goes on in Vegas is definitely gambling and they allow it but guys getting together for a weekly poker game for cash stakes are breaking the law, why ? Simple... because the jackboots are not getting their "cut" from the neighborhood poker games.
Reb wrote:
Who can respect law enforcement where "gambling" is concerned ? I can't and do not. What goes on in Vegas is definitely gambling and they allow it but guys getting together for a weekly poker game for cash stakes are breaking the law, why ? Simple... because the jackboots are not getting their "cut" from the neighborhood poker games.
I like this guy, he has brains and some mighty balls
there can only be 2 systems - complete anarchy or a mafia state where governemnt officials legaly or illegaly takes a cut from vices, anything inbetween in a facade
Reb wrote:
Who can respect law enforcement where "gambling" is concerned ? I can't and do not. What goes on in Vegas is definitely gambling and they allow it but guys getting together for a weekly poker game for cash stakes are breaking the law, why ? Simple... because the jackboots are not getting their "cut" from the neighborhood poker games.
Are neighborhood poker games illegal in Nevada? I do know the big US Gambling Casinos are behind the US ban on Internet poker which puts us in violation of all kinds of international treaties.
No RELIGION has a monopoly on an acceptable way 2 play chess; no who has the right 2 play it. This is another example of how RELIGION undermines human development. Obviously, the religious folks, can't discern between Learning & Gambling.
SZ.
Deranged wrote:
I won't get too stuck into religious talk because I know it may offend some people, but I personally think that no scholar or prophet should have complete control over the life of another being.
Right! 
SZ.
szammie wrote:
Deranged wrote:
I won't get too stuck into religious talk because I know it may offend some people, but I personally think that no scholar or prophet should have complete control over the life of another being.
Right!
SZ.
Quoting yourself is a bit over the top, don't you think ? For believing Muslims, it is not the prophet or the scholars whom they are obeying, but God. The prophet is a messenger who transmits God's message. The scholars are, in theory, interpreting the message to find out how it applies to the current conditions.
This thread is sort of useless: there are Saudi players here at chess.com. If chess is good enough for them maybe it's unnecessary for us to inquire about the OT topic.
Atos wrote:
szammie wrote:
Deranged wrote:
I won't get too stuck into religious talk because I know it may offend some people, but I personally think that no scholar or prophet should have complete control over the life of another being.
Right!
SZ.
Quoting yourself is a bit over the top, don't you think ? For believing Muslims, it is not the prophet or the scholars whom they are obeying, but God. The prophet is a messenger who transmits God's message. The scholars are, in theory, interpreting the message to find out how it applies to the current conditions.
What? How am I quoting myself? 
I quoted Deranged; n case u missed it (how u missed it, I don't know). Also, I would love 2 hear "GOD'S message", regarding the proper way 2 play chess! 
An interpretation, is not always correct. Besides, who is the 'interpreter' of "GOD'S message"?
SZ.
echecs06 wrote:
The problem, in my modest opinion, is that "prophets", "priests', whatever title you give them, are poor and imperfect messengers of "God". God's messages are good, His "intermediaries" are human, therefore not perfect.
Nice!
SZ.
Oh, okay you were quoting Deranged - it almost sounded like you were quoting yourself.
As to who can interpret the message - in theory everyone, but the legal rulings are usually based on the interpretations of one of the several traditional schools of Islamic jurisprudence.
Atos wrote:
Oh, okay you were quoting Deranged - it almost sounded like you were quoting yourself.
As to who can interpret the message - in theory everyone, but the legal rulings are usually based on the interpretations of one of the several traditional schools of Islamic jurisprudence.
'Legal rulings', on the interpretations, of the message of GOD? Do u have any idea how warped that sounds?
SZ.
szammie wrote:
Atos wrote:
Oh, okay you were quoting Deranged - it almost sounded like you were quoting yourself.
As to who can interpret the message - in theory everyone, but the legal rulings are usually based on the interpretations of one of the several traditional schools of Islamic jurisprudence.
'Legal rulings', on the interpretations, of the message of GOD? Do u have any idea how warped that sounds?
SZ.
Or at any rate, rulings on what is permissible and what is forbidden according to Islam, whether or not they have legal force.
echecs06 wrote:
Atos wrote:
Oh, okay you were quoting Deranged - it almost sounded like you were quoting yourself.
As to who can interpret the message - in theory everyone, but the legal rulings are usually based on the interpretations of one of the several traditional schools of Islamic jurisprudence.
Can you cite some for my enlightment. The Roman Catholic Church, for example, has " the Fathers of the Church" (St Augustine, St Anselme, St Gerome, St Thomas Aquinas,.to name a few...Thanks.
The four main schools of jurisprudence in Sunni Islam are Hanafi, Hanbali, Shafii and Maliki, in Shiite Islam the main school is Jafari.
newshutz wrote:
I am teaching chess in after school enrichment classes. Some of my students may be Muslim, and I presume that the parents are ok with chess, because they must sign the students up for the class.
I would like to use poker chips as markers on the board to make somethings more visible in lessons (example the knights move).
This chips have never been used for gambling.
Does anyone know if this is ok according to Islam?
Yes its pretty much okay....infact many good players over here tend to be strict followers of their religion too.
These scholars are mad, they are ignoring the basic thing that chess in those days was a very different game than it is now. It was played with a dice and so was a game of chance.
newshutz wrote:
I am teaching chess in after school enrichment classes. Some of my students may be Muslim, and I presume that the parents are ok with chess, because they must sign the students up for the class.
I would like to use poker chips as markers on the board to make somethings more visible in lessons (example the knights move).
This chips have never been used for gambling.
Does anyone know if this is ok according to Islam?
I'm reading this again now... my last post probably didm't answer the question. You seem to have been too cautious, that should have no problems ofcourse.
Elroch wrote:
Correct. And chess involves no chance on the part of the players, only skill. Chess is a game without a random element. The practical consequence is that in chess there is (at least one) absolute best move which produces at least a certain result (and exactly that result if the opponent does not make a mistake). Every win in chess is exploitation of a crucial error by the opponent. To say there is a chance element in chess is (to a game theorist) like saying there is a chance element in arithmetic: in truth there are only right answers and wrong answers.
Perfect. I'm convinced that chess is NOT haraam and I'll continue to play it.
Latvianfan wrote:
I would just like to share this. I couldn't help but chuckle.
Taken from http://www.islamweb.net/emainpage/index.php?page=showfatwa&Option=FatwaId&Id=89002
Question My son is very eager about playing the chess. He has been taken masters degree in chess from the university and now he teaches the chess in college to his students. He participates in the competitions of the chess in different cities and wins the prizes because it is his job. But he doesn't play on bet. Somebody told me that its a bad profession. So what is your opinion about playing and teaching the chess?
Answer
Chess game is of three kinds:
1) Chess that includes compensation: It is forbidden according to the agreement of scholars. Imaam Ibn 'Abdul-Barr said: 'The scholars agreed in a consensus that playing chess for compensation is gambling and it is forbidden.'
2) If playing chess leads to abandoning an obligation or committing a forbidden act, like not performing the prayer, or abandoning being dutiful to parents, telling a lie and false swearing. Shaykh Al-Islam Ibn Taymiyyah said: 'This form of chess is forbidden according to the consensus of all scholars.'
3) If playing is free from all kinds of prohibitions: If it is without compensation and does not involve abandoning an obligation or committing a forbidden act, then the scholars differed about it. Some are of the view that it is forbidden and some others are of the opinion that it is dislikeable. The Hanafi and Hanbali Schools are of the view that it is forbidden. However, it is confirmed that 'Ali passed by a people who were playing chess and asked them: 'What are these statues to which you are devoted?"
'Abdullaah Ibn 'Umar was asked about chess and he replied: 'It is forbidden like the dice.' Ibn 'Abbaas was managing a property of an orphan and he found chess in it, so he burnt it. Abu Moosaa Al-Ash'aree said: 'It is only a sinner who would play chess.'
The Shaafi'ee School are of the view that chess is dislikeable. However, Al-Balqeeni who was from the Shaafi'ee School objected to the opinion of his school and said that it is permissible if it is free from all prohibitions. Moreover, it is reported thatSa'eed Ibn Jubayr and Sa'eed Ibn Al-Mussayyib, and some righteous predecessors used to play chess.
The Maaliki School are of the view that if it is rarely played then it is dislikeable, but if one is addicted to it, then he could not be permitted to testify in court.
To conclude, playing chess is of three kinds: Two are exclusively forbidden, and the third is differed about among the scholars but the majority of them are of the opinion that it is forbidden. This is enough of a deterrence for a sound Muslim against playing this game or teaching it, let alone taking it as a profession to earn his living.
Allaah knows best.
Hah lol, I am a Muslim who memorized 1/3 of the Quran and take Islam VERY SERIOUSLY and I know alot of this sounds like BS. Chess encourages thinking and logical evaluation.
If you read history, silly things were done by Muslim extremists such as prohibiting the study of astronomy because it allegedly "make you doubt Islam" or "it is none of your business" where in reality it is recommended to learn and search for the truth ("ayas"; signs of the Universe prove Islam to be the truth)
Apr 14, 2017
0
#100
Please conduct any religious discussion in the Open Discussion club at https://www.chess.com/club/open-discussion rather than in the public forums.
Thanks,
David, moderator
Fascinating topic. I hope it doesn't get locked due to the forum ban on religious discussions. I don't see any religious bashing on this thread. Everyone is playing well together.
A very good read. Carry on.