Opening, Middle-game, or Endgame, Which is most critical for improving your chess and why?

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llama44

Beginners get thrown off because 5.c4 seems to give away a pawn.

Just ignore it and develop. 

"Just ignore it and develop" would probably improve the results of post-beginners quite a bit.

Real beginners, naa, just capture it. Your beginner opponents probably blundered it

llama44
SNUDOO wrote:
llama44 wrote:

Is the catalan somehow good against that?

I'm not trying to be coy, I'm just saying.

I was making fun about how "nobody plays the catalan"

fun fact, Hikaru actually said that on stream; he said, "The catalan? who plays the catalan?" lol

Maybe at the super GM level it's drawish?

Or maybe it's seen as bad for blitz at the top blitz levels?

Because otherwise the Catalan is a great opening

sndeww
llama44 wrote:
SNUDOO wrote:
llama44 wrote:

Is the catalan somehow good against that?

I'm not trying to be coy, I'm just saying.

I was making fun about how "nobody plays the catalan"

fun fact, Hikaru actually said that on stream; he said, "The catalan? who plays the catalan?" lol

Maybe at the super GM level it's drawish?

Or maybe it's seen as bad for blitz at the top blitz levels?

Because otherwise the Catalan is a great opening

Honestly how many Catalans have you seen in your games? For me it's zero, I think. I haven't checked.

blueemu
korotky_trinity wrote:

It's almost always one can easily see what he should do in the end of the game.

It's not always that easy. There are certain positions where you really need to know the winning method, since they are not intuitive and are very tricky to calculate.
 



llama44
SNUDOO wrote:
llama44 wrote:
SNUDOO wrote:
llama44 wrote:

Is the catalan somehow good against that?

I'm not trying to be coy, I'm just saying.

I was making fun about how "nobody plays the catalan"

fun fact, Hikaru actually said that on stream; he said, "The catalan? who plays the catalan?" lol

Maybe at the super GM level it's drawish?

Or maybe it's seen as bad for blitz at the top blitz levels?

Because otherwise the Catalan is a great opening

Honestly how many Catalans have you seen in your games? For me it's zero, I think. I haven't checked.

I'm a 1.e4 player, but I've dabbled with 1.Nf3 and the catalan even in tournament games.

As black I've played against the Catalan a few times... Kramnik made a living out of playing it, so it's obviously a good opening. Maybe the latest trends are not in favor of it... but lets just say in a match of Naka vs Kramnik I'd bet on Kramnik

sndeww
llama44 wrote:
SNUDOO wrote:
llama44 wrote:
SNUDOO wrote:
llama44 wrote:

Is the catalan somehow good against that?

I'm not trying to be coy, I'm just saying.

I was making fun about how "nobody plays the catalan"

fun fact, Hikaru actually said that on stream; he said, "The catalan? who plays the catalan?" lol

Maybe at the super GM level it's drawish?

Or maybe it's seen as bad for blitz at the top blitz levels?

Because otherwise the Catalan is a great opening

Honestly how many Catalans have you seen in your games? For me it's zero, I think. I haven't checked.

I'm a 1.e4 player, but I've dabbled with 1.Nf3 and the catalan even in tournament games.

As black I've played against the Catalan a few times... Kramnik made a living out of playing it, so it's obviously a good opening. Maybe the latest trends are not in favor of it... but lets just say in a match of Naka vs Kramnik I'd bet on Kramnik

I'm not saying the Catalan is bad, I'm saying there aren't as many people who play it often. I just don't see it a lot.

llama44

Since Naka was a perennial top 10 player it's kind of surprising, but he broke 2800 only once, and only briefly, I think about 6 years ago... meanwhile Kramnik was a world champion.

It reminds me of Maurice Ashley's story about asking Judit Polgar (when Judit Polgar was in the top 10) how close she was to world champion level.

Judit's response was that there isn't just one level separating her from world champ, there are multiple levels she would have to improve. In other words while the difference between number 5 and number 3 may seem like nothing to us, sometimes to the players it seems like a huge difference.

IIRC Naka made it all the way to #3 in the world, but honestly I think Kramnik is in a different class.

sndeww
llama44 wrote:

Since Naka was a perennial top 10 player it's kind of surprising, but he broke 2800 only once, and only briefly, I think about 6 years ago... meanwhile Kramnik was a world champion.

It reminds me of Maurice Ashley's story about asking Judit Polgar (when Judit Polgar was in the top 10) how close she was to world champion level.

Judit's response was that there isn't just one level separating her from world champ, there are multiple levels she would have to improve. In other words while the difference between number 5 and number 3 may seem like nothing to us, sometimes to the players it seems like a huge difference.

IIRC Naka made it all the way to #3 in the world, but honestly I think Kramnik is in a different class.

Personally I think Naka was memeing when he said that, because he was playing blindfold blitz at a 2400 level and wasn't impressed with his 1800-1900 competition until WFM Alexandra Botez got matched with him

Of course, he didn't know until after the match was over.

llama44

Haha ok. 

And I'm ranting a bit, I realize I am

llama44

Wow, so many red banners. I may be muted soon.

sndeww

How

llama44

I posted a word that would make 5 year olds giggle, so apparently that was too risque.

You didn't see it because chess.com ate the message and it was deleted.

If a person does this too many times they get muted... and I don't think there's a cool down. In other words 5 months from now I may be muted on my first attempt while today I was just given a warning.

sid0049

How many warnings does it take?

llama44

I don't know how it works. Maybe there's a point system and after a certain threshold you're muted.

I've been muted twice so far by the red banner thing.

First time took about 5 times (it wasn't really my fault, I was trying to quote someone, and there's a known bug for that).

Second time took less IIRC, but the two instances were so far apart I'm not sure.

llama44

The mute only lasts 24 hours by the way.

sid0049

Is it possible for the account to be blocked?

llama44

I'm not sure what you mean.

All users have the option to "block" someone. This has the effect of not allowing the user to post in your topics or send you messages.

What I'm talking about is being muted. The website, or a moderator, or a staff member can mute you. When that happens you can't post anywhere, including private messages or private groups, and the duration can be under a day, or permanently.

sid0049

I see.

Yeah i was asking abouted muted

DiogenesDue
SNUDOO wrote:
llama44 wrote:

Yes, in 1.d4 games I play 1...Nf6 now, but it hardly matters. You could walk into a world championship match armed with 1...d5 as you primary response against 1.d4.

You'd have to know the openings, though. Like what if white plays... Catalan? colle? London formation? Barry attack? (That's just a random name I remembered)

What will you play? Slav? (theory) QGD? what kind of declined? Colle-Zukertort formation? Tarrasch?

You will need to know what you want to do in the opening.

You really don't, though, not at the ratings level this thread is primarily addressing.  No matter what your opponent plays, you can just play out your center pawns to e4/d4/e5/d5...whatever is uncontested, then just start developing.  This will work just fine up to 1500 rating:

...all perfectly viable.

Same thing for black...what you should try sometime is this exercise:

- White or black, for your first 2 moves, play only c4, d4, e4, for f4 (c5, d5, e5, f5 for black)...whichever 2 pawns your opponent's move allow for without capture

- Develop as best you can from there...

Then take it a 3rd step...play out 2 center pawns, and then randomly choose a knight or a bishop to develop...also pretty much all viable.

You will find it's all pretty much viable up to 1500 rating and somewhat beyond.  You don't have to memorize jack.  You don't really even need to know the names of the openings you are playing.  If you get offered something, look at it with skepticism wink.png.  The really subtle traps you will find out about and learn to avoid.

Also, play 960...you'll learn at a more top-down level how to play a decent opening without any turn by turn roadmap.

I actually would love to see what would happen to a chess player that played 960 from the beginning and trained that way all the way up to 1500, and only then limited themselves to the classic starting position. 

sndeww
btickler wrote:
SNUDOO wrote:
llama44 wrote:

Yes, in 1.d4 games I play 1...Nf6 now, but it hardly matters. You could walk into a world championship match armed with 1...d5 as you primary response against 1.d4.

You'd have to know the openings, though. Like what if white plays... Catalan? colle? London formation? Barry attack? (That's just a random name I remembered)

What will you play? Slav? (theory) QGD? what kind of declined? Colle-Zukertort formation? Tarrasch?

You will need to know what you want to do in the opening.

You really don't, though, not at the ratings level this thread is primarily addressing.  No matter what your opponent plays, you can just play out your center pawns to e4/d4/e5/d5...whatever is uncontested, then just start developing.  This will work just fine up to 1500 rating:

...all perfectly viable.

Same thing for black...what you should try sometime is this exercise:

- White or black, for your first 2 moves, play only c4, d4, e4, for f4 (c5, d5, e5, f5 for black)...whichever 2 pawns your opponent's move allow for without capture

- Develop as best you can from there...

Then take it a 3rd step...play out 2 center pawns, and then randomly choose a knight or a bishop to develop...also pretty much all viable.

You will find it's all pretty much viable up to 1500 rating and somewhat beyond.  You don't have to memorize jack.  You don't really even need to know the names of the openings you are playing.  If you get offered something, look at it with skepticism .  The really subtle traps you will find out about and learn to avoid.

Also, play 960...you'll learn at a more top-down level how to play a decent opening without any turn by turn roadmap.

I actually would love to see what would happen to a chess player that played 960 from the beginning and trained that way all the way up to 1500, and only then limited themselves to the classic starting position. 

good post, but the OP is around 1700 rating 😂