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Racism on live chess

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Irontiger

Poverty is still the one main big huge enormous explanation for criminality. Comparing <insert third-world country in civil war or bloody dictatorship here> and the US only proves crime prosecution is more efficient in the US.

netzach

Yes and the US imprisons a lot of individuals mainly because is highly-developed/civilised country.

Similar (narcotics) offences in Europe will be proportionately much worse.

TheGrobe

And, for that matter, why are the sentences more or less severe depending on the form the same drug takes?

Ziryab

A long history of instutionalized discrimination from formal slavery, to de  facto segregation, to redlining in housing, to ...

Ziryab
TheGrobe wrote:

And, for that matter, why are the sentences more or less severe depending on the form the same drug takes?

Racialist and racist perceptions of the severity of the crime infect sentencing laws.

TheGrobe

Institutionalized discrimination sounds a whole lot like the same thing as systemic racism.

Ziryab
TheGrobe wrote:

Institutionalized discrimination sounds a whole lot like the same thing as systemic racism.

It is, with one key difference. Institutionalized discrimination also exists against fat people. Systemic racism (or racism distinguished from prejudice, according to a popular definition) is institutionalized discrimination on the basis of race. There are other bases for discrimination. 

TheGrobe

I thought fat was a race.

astronomer999
Ziryab wrote:
TheGrobe wrote:

Institutionalized discrimination sounds a whole lot like the same thing as systemic racism.

It is, with one key difference. Institutionalized discrimination also exists against fat people. Systemic racism (or racism distinguished from prejudice, according to a popular definition) is institutionalized discrimination on the basis of race. There are other bases for discrimination. 

Institutionalised discrimination against fat people? What a load of crap. They get all sorts of benefits from the medical system that get subsidised by people who aren't fat. They don't pay for their extra weight when they travel and the poor dears can't be told how fat they are as their "self esteem" must be protected. Being fat is a choice. Being black, white, red or yellow is a result of evolution

astronomer999
TheGrobe wrote:

I thought fat was a race.

Fat comes from an inadequate amount of races

TheGrobe

What about phat people?

AlCzervik
TheGrobe wrote:

I thought fat was a race.

A slow one.

Irontiger
astronomer999 wrote:

Being fat is a choice.

Geneticians disagree. And when you see what I eat while being under average weigth, you would understand that is not true.

Although, true, there is more options to try not to be fat that trying not to be Black...

Ziryab
astronomer999 wrote:
Ziryab wrote:
TheGrobe wrote:

Institutionalized discrimination sounds a whole lot like the same thing as systemic racism.

It is, with one key difference. Institutionalized discrimination also exists against fat people. Systemic racism (or racism distinguished from prejudice, according to a popular definition) is institutionalized discrimination on the basis of race. There are other bases for discrimination. 

Institutionalised discrimination against fat people? What a load of crap. They get all sorts of benefits from the medical system that get subsidised by people who aren't fat. They don't pay for their extra weight when they travel and the poor dears can't be told how fat they are as their "self esteem" must be protected. Being fat is a choice. Being black, white, red or yellow is a result of evolution

They get harrassed by the medical system, and often shamed. Some insurance companies are dropping the obese, or charging employers more if they hire the obese (it's even worse for smokers). They must pay double the usual airfare to find a seat that does not cause physical distress. They are discriminated against in many jobs.

While fat can be cultivated by choice, it is also genetic and often aggravated by certain conditions (such as those affecting the thyroid).

The point, in any case, is the difference between institutionalized discrimination (which you perceive as existing against the gaunt) and racism. Systemic oppression may be racial, but it may stem from some other prejudice. Among the many possibilities, racism is the most significant basis for discrimination in Western societies (Europe and its spawn). It has a deeply rooted historical base, afflicts even the language of everyday speech, and has proven stubborn to eradicate. New expressions of racist ideology can be found in the news regularly (this week it comes from SCOTUS Justice Scalia).

astronomer999
Irontiger wrote:
astronomer999 wrote:

Being fat is a choice.

Geneticians disagree. And when you see what I eat while being under average weigth, you would understand that is not true.

Although, true, there is more options to try not to be fat that trying not to be Black...

So if you have a particularly efficient metabolism, eat less. A friend of mine, who is old enough to remember, points out that you never see fat people in a concentration camp

astronomer999
Ziryab wrote:
astronomer999 wrote:
Ziryab wrote:
TheGrobe wrote:

Institutionalized discrimination sounds a whole lot like the same thing as systemic racism.

It is, with one key difference. Institutionalized discrimination also exists against fat people. Systemic racism (or racism distinguished from prejudice, according to a popular definition) is institutionalized discrimination on the basis of race. There are other bases for discrimination. 

Institutionalised discrimination against fat people? What a load of crap. They get all sorts of benefits from the medical system that get subsidised by people who aren't fat. They don't pay for their extra weight when they travel and the poor dears can't be told how fat they are as their "self esteem" must be protected. Being fat is a choice. Being black, white, red or yellow is a result of evolution

They get harrassed by the medical system, and often shamed. Some insurance companies are dropping the obese, or charging employers more if they hire the obese (it's even worse for smokers). They must pay double the usual airfare to find a seat that does not cause physical distress. They are discriminated against in many jobs.

While fat can be cultivated by choice, it is also genetic and often aggravated by certain conditions (such as those affecting the thyroid).

 

Being given advice to get thinner is not harrassment or shaming. While I understand that Yanks have the world's stupidest and most expensive health system, I say that charging more for riskier patients is fair.

Fat people drive up demand for healthcare interventions, and basic economics says that higher demand leads to higher prices

astronomer999
Irontiger wrote:
astronomer999 wrote:

Being fat is a choice.

Geneticians disagree. And when you see what I eat while being under average weigth, you would understand that is not true.

Although, true, there is more options to try not to be fat that trying not to be Black...

Your profile says you are early 20s.

Advice for you is that if you continue to eat like a teenager, you will get fat. I noticed it when I was 23 or 24. Simple explanation is that your body's development is a wasteful process. It takes energy to build cells and proteins, and your body throws out any imperfect results. You stop developing early 20s, so you have the choice of eating less, or living hard

corrijean
Ziryab wrote:
TheGrobe wrote:

And, for that matter, why are the sentences more or less severe depending on the form the same drug takes?

Racialist and racist perceptions of the severity of the crime infect sentencing laws.

According to Freakonomics, the original reason for the disparity in crack vs. cocaine sentencing was due to the disproportionate amount of violence associated with crack. 

Don't know I don't know how valid that point of view is. The legacy effects IMO have been negative, so I am glad there has been some sentencing reform.

GenghisCant

I don't see how comparing race and obesity really works.

You definitely choose to be fat. Sure, genetically, some poeple are more prone to becoming overweight than others. I understand that. Others are prone to being thinner. However, nobody gets to 350+lbs by eating their recommended 2500 calories a day. That's just ludacris.

As for paying more for airfair, why shouldn't they? Last time I was on holiday, there was a guy on our flight who must have weighed maybe 300lbs. When I checked my bag, we discovered it was something like 2kg over the allowance and I had to pay an additional 40-50 euros to get it on the plane (my own fault of course. That's their policy so fine). This guy, on his own, weighs more than both me and my bag put together (not taking into account his suitcase). If I am having to pay so much for an additional 2kg, why shouldn't he have to pay a bit extra for his flight?

Obviously this is not enforcable. You can't line people up at the airport, weigh them and then charge by the pound. That would be a disgusting way to treat people. It's not a cattle market. It is just a bit irritating.

Gilded_Candlelight

I see the issue as unfair discrimination. We discriminate all the time but judging based on color of skin is unfair because it is unmerited and therefore not efficient. Again, if you read about genetics you know that is is possible for two black people to have a white child. I think people get confused because there are some confusing terms. For instance, skin pigmentation is not about complete dominance, it is comprised of semi-dominance which is unfortunately misleading. We use semi dominance instead of co-dominance which refers to  a segmented expression rather than a blend you get from semi dominance. Since there are many things that go into the make up of skin pigmentation the issue gets even more complicated. If you subscribe to selfish gene theory then you do not think that genes "stick together" but rather genes are in a battle themselves to survive within the organism and could care less what the genes that are dictating the size of your pinky are doing. Now some genes give a person a disposition, like making weight easier to gain. But that is different than a gene which makes your hair curly. Your hair is curly. Curly hair genes are there because they, at one time provided some advantage for the organism (or the whole option of curly non curly was a moot mutation). It makes  no sense that curly hair genes are going to encourage act unhelpful genes to survive. Lets even say for instance there was a gene that made you kind, civil, intelligent, charming, and clear headed. And lets pretend this gene did this without making you a sociopath (joking). How long does that gene take to saturate the population? if these are really advantages, then not long. Its called micro evolution and it can happen really fast. Which brings up another point. People who want to keep their "race pure" are idiots. Genes that are disadvantageous to a population are quickly eliminated. Even if race did exist for humans (which is does not), you would not want to isolate yourself from the advantages of other gene populations. How does isolationism work out for organisms? well check out the history books when nations have isolated themselves. Brilliant. And I am not advocating discriminating against people with weight issues. But we have to realize that discrimination that is merited is different than prejudice that is unmerited. So the lack of understanding of genetics by racist is the real problem. As far as I am concerned crazy people who refuse to recognize observable phenomena are the real culprits. And they cross "race", culture, size, gender, sex orientation etc. And they are all crazy in the same way, though it is expressed differently. They refuse to be rational even when it is hurting themselves. There are no races, there are populations, which may go through microevolutionary processes but they are not aliens. And isolating genetic populations is not advantageous as if gives the species as a whole less options to draw on and creates "bubbles" (like economic bubbles) of weakness. Also genetic dispositions are not the same as explicit genes which result in unalterable and natural genetic expression. So if you think race is real for humans, you are 

A)ignorant because you have not been exposed to data stating otherwise (hard to have that excuse now)

B) a liar and just using rhetoric to influence people around you

C) Crazy

D) Talking about the Amazing Race, which is a terrible show. No I kid. Its not that bad. 

 

Given that you must believe in race to be racist then you must be one of these things if you are racist also. You cannot just sit back and say "I abstain". When someone irrationally discriminates against a group it is only a matter of time before it is your turn too. Dont ask for whom the bell tolls, it tolls for thee. Now some people think there are no racist. Well that is absurd. If you know race does not exist yet you have a strong correlation between the idea of race and the metrics we measure human happiness and success by, then someone is being an effing racist. And how do you combat people who are either crazy, ignorant, or liars? you tell the truth in a simple and concise way. When the truth shines on the ignorant they put their egos aside and grow. When it shines on the liars they run and hide. And when it shines on crazy people they just get crazier and that my friends is when you get to "exterminate with extreme prejudice!", lol no I kid. Violence increases entropy and risk while decreasing predictable rewards. But I think you understand what I am saying. And some people do have trouble with their weight but America has a caring problem. We dont care how we eat. People starve in other countries. Maybe the woman who could have created cold fusion starved. Or the guy who could find clean and efficient water salinization. Weigh (no pun intended) that against the guy who cant help but eat 5000 calories a day and tell me what is fair. 

PS I didnt edit my post for spelling or grammatical errors. 

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