SCID vs PC

More information on the Clipbase, if you haven't seen it already:

http://scidvspc.sourceforge.net/doc/Clipbase.htm

There's no substitute though, for experience.  (Meaning, play around with it for awhile.)

im analyzing a game atm but im not sure if im using or reading it correctly.

i have loaded the pgn and started analysis.

the analysis appears to be giving analysis one move at a time unlike chess.coms analysis which aanlyzes the whole game and provides a list of moves and recommended alternative moves for blunders etc.

am i correct in thinking that it analyzes one move at a time?

as i move from one move to another on the board the analysis gives what it thinks is the next best move. is that correct?

atm i have a list of 29 recommended moves in reply to 1.e4 ...c6 

For 2. is the first recommended move the best one or do i choose the 29th move when the analysis is finished.

In the first column it gives a + or - number in brackets. does that number refer to the position as it stands before the current recommended move or does it mean that the position will be that number when the recommended move is played?

it doesnt seem to point out blunders like chess.coms analysis.

do i simply go by the + or - in the first column to decide myself if the last move was a blunder?

thanks for any help. im not techie at all as you probably gathered but i managed to import the photos from wiki and fide etc.

they are a nice feature of scid. thanks for the tip and the other advice given

You are right, analysis mode runs the engine on current position to find the best move.

There is also an option to analyse the whole game and search for blunders. In the analysis tab, click on "Annotate" button and set the options (the value of "threshold" defines when a move should be considered a blunder - it is the difference in score before and after a move above which the move will be marked as a blunder)

Yes, unless you check "Lock to current position" the analysis updates as you browse between the moves

atm i have a list of 29 recommended moves in reply to 1.e4 ...c6 

For 2. is the first recommended move the best one or do i choose the 29th move when the analysis is finished.

In the first column it gives a + or - number in brackets. does that number refer to the position as it stands before the current recommended move or does it mean that the position will be that number when the recommended move is played?

it doesnt seem to point out blunders like chess.coms analysis.

As stated above, you can use "annotate" and choose preferred "threshold" to have blunders automatically detected

do i simply go by the + or - in the first column to decide myself if the last move was a blunder?

Those + or - is the current evaluation of the position from white's perspective, i.e. + means white is better and - denotes black advantage. A losing blunder is when the score goes above +1,5 (below -1,5). The moves shown in the analysis pane is the best answer, i.e. refutation for the blunder

I would advice downloading a stronger engine than those packaged into Scid vs. PC by default. Look for stockfish - it is the best free engine, nearly as good as commercial houdini (elo difference is like 100 points which is neglectable at amateur level - anyway 3000+ is above the strongest human players)

After obtaining stockfish you can install it in Scid (select "UCI engine" option) and the analysis will be much more reliable compared to what the default engine can offer

I have used Scid since 2004 and I find it the best free chess database software, comparable to ChessBase.

Two things:

First, you can get Houdini 1.5a free online.  It's arguably better than Stockfish, although at our level, it really doesn't matter.

Second, if you allow the engine to analyze one move at a time, it will work from the present position, although I seldom if ever use it that way.  If you let the engine analyze a finished game, I think (at least in my Fritz 13) most engines will work backwards from the ending position back toward the opening which does give you a much better analysis of how you got where you ended up.

This is not the feature of engine, rather how Fritz gui uses the engine. Scid runs the analysis in forward mode no matter what engine you select.

If you install an opening book and choose it in the analysis options then your game is annotated from the last move which is found in the book. This can speed up the annotation process, especially when you play long theoretical lines like in RL or Najdorf.

Scid lets the engine calculate subsequent moves either until a specified depth or for a given amount of time (choose the option you prefer). When the difference in score gets above "threshold" (option you can set) the first line given by the engine is added as a variant to the move actually played in the game. Scid can also annotate moves with ?!, ?, !, !? (choose appropriate option) and add the score (like +0,3) to each move (again, an option)

If you want have your endgames analysed quicker I would recommend you installing Nalimov tablebases and setup the engine to use them. This also makes the engine stronger at lower depths because it can know the exact result of an endgame without calculating long lines.

Actually Fritz looks at both ends.  It first checks a database for the opening up to the point of departure from "book," then moves to the end and works backwards toward that point.  I always thought that was a function of the engine, not the GUI, but then I haven't used any other GUIs (although I do have Arena 3.0 and SCID vs PC) because I like Fritz interface better.  I'll check the other GUIs out one of these days to see if it's the GUI or the engine that decides how to analyze.

Thanks dzikus and mldavis617

I clicked the annotate button in analysis and selected blunders and changed trheshold to 1.5

when i started analysis it still only analyzed move by move. it didnt give me a complete game analysis.

can you let me how to do it or tell me what im doing wrong

i have stockfish installed on it

I love Scid vs Pc.  i use 4.9.1 for wind64.  The program says snackpack not found at startup and I cant seem to get any sound working.  Besides that though it works great.  I use it more than fritz13.  Actually I may never buy another commercial product since there are such great open source software like scidvspc and stockfish 3.

here is a good db: http://icofy-blog.de/icofy-base/

"There is also an option to analyse the whole game and search for blunders. In the analysis tab, click on "Annotate" button and set the options"

"Scid can also annotate moves with ?!, ?, !, !? (choose appropriate option) and add the score (like +0,3) to each move (again, an option)"

@dzikus i followed your instruction and clicked on annotate and set the options but it still only analyzes one move at a time

i did not see any option to have scid annotate with ?! etc

@analyzethispgn: it analyses move after move - wait until it arrives at the last move of the game

As far as I remember you should not click on the board during annotating, just let it process through the whole game. Depending on your settings this can be quite fast (and inaccurate) or lengthy (but reliable). To see how that works you may first limit the time of analysis per move (set it to a few seconds). The game should get annotated quickly

For purposes of learning where you played badly I would recommend setting the limit on calculation depth. I usually give 30 - this may be slow but it is a reasonable depth

thanks Dzikus. im still not sure its working correct.

ive set annotate to blunders and started the analysis. it just stayed stuck on the analysis of the first move.

i then hit the blue arrow button with the arrow and it moves through the game analyzing it. ill let u know if it gives me a rundown of the whole analysis of the game when its finished.

i have another small problem. i would like to play against the computer as black. how do i change the settings as it only lets me play as white atm.

also @MrEdcollins i have downloaded the opening book from the links you gave along with the photos.

how do I set up the opening book with scid. there are a few files in the folder and im not sure if i import them into scids bin folder like the photos.

analysis of the game has just finished and it didnt give me a rundown of the full game analysis.

what am i doing wrong

can someone give me specific instructions to set up scid to give me a full game analysis rundown similar to the way chess.com gives its analysis.

This is an example of analysis produced by Scid vs. PC:

(this game was used as Sherlock Holmes vs. Dr. Moriarty in "Game of Shadows")

As you can see, every move is annotated with a score (evaluation) and Stockfish finds 23...Bf6?? as the losing blunder suggesting 23...f5 instead with equal position. There is also a smaller blunder at move 26 which does not however change the result, black loses just more quickly.

I obtained the result by moving to the start of the game and clicking "Annotate" button in the analysis pane. In "Configure Annotation" popup I selected Add Scores->All moves, Add Variations->When move is a blunder, Which Side->Moves by both sides, Use book (gm2600.bin) and set numerical options at the top: Seconds per move:=120, Blunder Threshold:=0.5

@dzikus  that is the kind of analysis im looking for.

i have started the analysisusing the steps that you provided.

the game is currently moving move by move and the analysis is displaying a list of recommended moves for the next move.

is this correct so far or should the game not be moving and i just wait for a complete analysis.

thanks for helping me out with this

@analyzethispgn, yes - this is how analysis proceeds in Scid vs PC

When you see the last move annotated (if the game was not finished in a mate then also the best continuation is shown as a variation) you can stop the engine and your pgn is annotated

Play with the settings in "Configure Annotation" to find a setup which best suites your needs:

• if you are interested in seeing more variations check Add Variations->When move is not best - this shows any deviation from engine's first line
• if you have your own analysis added and want to check it - choose to annotate variations
• if you want to find more inaccuracies but nevertheless are not interested in finding all deviations from first lines - decrease the value of "Blunder Threshold" to something below 0.5

There are no word comments as in Fritz but move strength marks like !, ? and position evaluation like =, +=, -/+ are added

The analysis has finished but all i see is one line saying

100 [m1] 34....Rxh#  (0.15)

i did not get a complete analysis rundown in the analysis window

i then clicked on the pgn game 1 tab in the analysis windwo and i got a run down but only from move 27 which it says is a massive +44 blunder

how do i get the full run down

Annotations are all available in pgn window, the analysis window only shows the current move being evaluated, that is the last move if whole game has been analysed. So, the analysis window is only useful if you want to see what the engine "thinks" about a particular position but when you run annotation it is the pgn window where all results are stored.

If you only got one blunder but need a more detailed analysis try setting a lower threshold or set the option to add variations for the moves which are not best.

how do i copy the analysis from the pgn window

how can i get it like the example you shown e.g from move 1

after analysis is finished my pgn window only shows the analysis from the blunder

one other Qs. can i play through another game or position while one game is being analyzed

sorry for all the Qs but its frustrating to use

To copy all of the analysis, activate the PGN window, highlight the moves, and copy to memory.  You can them paste elsewhere as desired.

Regarding playing through other games while one game is being analyzed...  I suppose you can always open up another copy of Scid vs. PC.  As I type this, I've got two copies running... one is analyzing one of my over-the-board tournament games, and as a test, with the other program I'm stepping through and browsing a Spassky-Larsen game.

The Scid vs. PC documentation file is actually quite thorough.  If you haven't read it yet, you definitely should.

If Scid vs. PC is frustrating, don't use it.  There are half a dozen other GUIs available, that will probably do what you wish.  (Tarrash, WinBoard, Arena, Fritz, etc.)