Students that hate to discuss their mistakes

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gbidari

Yes it's definitely a psychological problem. I will bring it up with him next lesson. Thank you all for your input. I sure needed it. If these ideas don't pan out I can always be like Larry David teaching chess: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mTEVn_BIE_U

nxavar

Give the child some breathing air! Chess can be too serious for that age. Children, due their energetic nature, have problem avoiding mistakes in real life so it's only natural that they tend to ignore "chessboard" mistakes too.

gbidari

Breathing air? What do you mean?

Baldr
hewettsanders965 wrote:

Glad to be a part of this awesome venue and look forward to meeting you online here.


Spammers suck.

nxavar
gbidari wrote:

Breathing air? What do you mean?


 If the child can't take it, be less strict about pointing out mistakes. Maybe talk only about the very general ones. And tolerate a cetain "mistakes level" :)

oinquarki

(Just to offer an opposite viewpoint;)

You're a personal trainer, not a public school teacher, which means you have a responsibility to your student to be straight-up honest with him, whether he appreciates it in the short-term or not, because if he's really serious about chess, which I'm assuming he is, seeing as how he's paying for private lessons with a master, then he'll get better and appreciate it in the long-term.

 

What's his rating by the way?

gbidari

His rating is 764.

oinquarki

Why does a 764 player need a master for a coach?

LavaRook

There are (almost) absolute beginners who go to my IM coach here so thats not that surprising lol....

Tell the kid that to improve in anything, you need to identify where you are going wrong and that at times you need to put your ego aside. Remind him that learning from your mistakes is a great way to improve. Try to be nice, but don't be afraid of beings straight up honest if you have to. Also don't forget complimenting on good moves.

erikido23

Have u thought maybe the way u bring it up may be poor? I had a coach that wanted to look over a game of mine. I told him I knew what I didwrong and would prefer not to. He said he wanted to see it. So, I reluctantly obliged.

When I got to the point where I blundered(was sacrificing the exchange and spent lots of time making sure I wasn't going to lose my center pawn. As soon as I moved I realized I did hang the center pawn) I start to explain what I was thinking and how it was a blunder he stops me and tells me to just state the move.

I tell him the move and then he starts telling me how it is a recurrent mistake(moving a piece backward). That moving a piece backwards is always wrong. Even if u think u calculate it out it just turns out wrong. When in reality it was just a miscalculation which I already knew was a mistake. Then half an hour later he shows me a backwards move and states it is good because it has an idea behind it(though all of them turn out bad?). What, a couple extra passed pawns for an exchange isn't an idea? Very strong player, but I think his analysis of games was of limited value(largely due to the fact that he would not listen when I said I understood what I had done wrong. There is a difference in going over a game u lose and u don't understand why and going over a game which u KNOW exactly why u lost). He convinced me to try a few more lessons and I did get some good out of some opening analysis. BUt, I have decided that I will only rarely if ever return.

Don't always assume the student is the problem.

blowerd
gbidari wrote:

Breathing air? What do you mean?


Its quite obvious your frustrated as you admit it in your opening post.  I agree with most others, I don't think the student is the problem here. 

Kingpatzer

I teach scuba diving. Scuba diving can be very stressful for some people, and when practicing a skill they can get really hard on themselves. 

 

In order to correct mistakes, I first start off finding SOMETHING they did well. Finding creative ways to say "I really like the way you barely managed to not kill both of us" can often be difficult. Finding a way to start the debrief of a skill with an honest appreciation for positives though is essential to keeping the student's confidence up. 

Next, when discussing what they did wrong making sure it's not personal and is entirely constructive is extremely hard. Some people naturally are very hard on themselves. Some are already harder on themselves than they should be. So finding a way to convey information on how to improve without beating them up more is critical. 

But those skills are what make for good coaches and teachers. 

Are you finding the things they are doing well and praising them honestly? If you can't find joy in their small successes, then how can they? 

It's that old honey versus vinegar thing all over again. No one likes being shown they aren't smart/strong/fast/whatever. But most people will push themselves significantly for some honest appreciation of their effort. 

izuna7

hey bidari who are you talking about? anyone i konw?

ChessTitan67
Yes, I agree with Natalia, it's seems the crux of the problem is a inferiority issue that needs to be broken before any further improvement can be expected.
Mac42

I wonder; is he taking the lessons of his own free will and accord  or is he being made to take the lessons by an adult? At age 12 if it isn't enjoyable they're not interested.

mSapuppo

in your last game against chaikovsky you missed a free queen on move 50 =]

mrguy888
mSapuppo wrote:

in your last game against chaikovsky you missed a free queen on move 50 =]


Was that worth reviving a half-year old thread to say? Think very hard about that.

mSapuppo

I thought very hard about it, and the age of the thread had no bearing. The title of the thread provided for an ironic musing.

Elubas

I've never understood the problem with bumping. If a thread nobody cares about is bumped, then we can just ignore it.

gbidari
mSapuppo wrote:

I thought very hard about it, and the age of the thread had no bearing. The title of the thread provided for an ironic musing.


Pointless. If you saw me hating to discuss a mistake I made, then that would be the irony you were looking for.