The French Offense ?....NOT really a defense @ all

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Boyangzhao

When the opening is called "french defence", it means something else. Since white moves first in a game, it's widely considered that all "defence openings are started by black. For example, besides the french, you have the indian defences, and which one is played is totally up to black, not white. You have a common defence.

 

And few people call it the "french defence" anyways. Many people just call it the "french."

Bishop_g5
The_Ghostess_Lola wrote:

But if I played 1. d4 and you played 1...d5 then I played 2. e4 and you played 2...e6 ?

Then you've established the French Defense 'cuz you started it.

 ...so if you instead played 2...dxe4 then it would not be an attacking move because White started it, right? You just defend by taking a pawn.

https://youtu.be/LpMfI-HMyxg

The_Ghostess_Lola
Boyangzhao wrote:

When the opening is called "french defence", it means something else. Since white moves first in a game, it's widely considered that all "defence openings are started by black. For example, besides the french, you have the indian defences, and which one is played is totally up to black, not white. You have a common defence.

 

And few people call it the "french defence" anyways. Many people just call it the "french."

It's just being shortened that's all. ECO C00-C19 is officially the French Defense....much to my disagreement w/out being humble about it.

The game is in the hands of white....especially on move #1. How can black claim to be playing a defense on Move #1 ? That's ridiculous !!

What kinda move is 1....e6 and then declare AND WITH SUPPORT FROM OFFICIAL CHESS NOMENCLATURE that they're in ala French Defense ?

This just doesn't make any sense to me. I'm sorry.

I can see a few more moves being played and then black possibly declaring it a French Defense, but then white owns grounds to call it an offensive or attack. 

I would be fine if it was called the French Attack. But there's something about the French Defense Attack that I don't like.

The_Ghostess_Lola
Bishop_g5 wrote:
The_Ghostess_Lola wrote:

But if I played 1. d4 and you played 1...d5 then I played 2. e4 and you played 2...e6 ?

Then you've established the French Defense 'cuz you started it.

 ...so if you instead played 2...dxe4 then it would not be an attacking move because White started it, right? You just defend by taking a pawn.

https://youtu.be/LpMfI-HMyxg

It would then be seen as a gambit, right ? And then there's no resemblance of a French anything.

The_Ghostess_Lola

All I wanna say is that one move on move one does not make a defense. It just makes a move.

Same with the Sicilian. Why does playing c5 after 1. e4 make it a defense ? Black is hypermodernly attacking the center by flank. I'd hardly call 1...c5 a defense. Not yet at least. It's way too early to label.

The_Ghostess_Lola

To me ?....I'd be willing to compromise and have everyone in chess call it the French Opening (English Opening ?) or the French Game (Spanish Game ?) or something like that.

....that'd make more sense.

Bishop_g5

A gambit from White prospective. From Black's ? What kind of a move it is? Attacking or defensive and why?

Black takes a pawn but loses on time and space control since he's d5 pawn was more central placed.

This is the point of the French defense and why it called a defensive mechanism starting with 1...e6. The idea is to defend the occupation of the d5 square. Black's pawn on d5 is more important than on e4 otherwise will not play 2...e6 to defend on it. 😉

The_Ghostess_Lola

You're probably right. Lemme think about that one....Smile....

yureesystem

Dear Lola, you are Charlotte Bronte of chess.com, you are so clever. happy.png

The_Ghostess_Lola
skotheim wrote:

 it is very simple. For black the opening is called defence because white has move advantage and for white it is attack.

For example Kings Indian Attack (white) or Kings indian defence (black)

Because black has the reacting move makes it not a defence. You're assuming that by default. But default can be dangerously misleading as in the Sicilian Defence.

The SD is a flank counterattack from move #1. It's hardly defensive.  

The_Ghostess_Lola
yureesystem wrote:

Dear Lola, you are Charlotte Bronte of chess.com, you are so clever.

omg !!....I luv Charlotte's work !!

....as "it is better to be w/out logic than to be w/out feeling".

llama
The_Ghostess_Lola wrote:
skotheim wrote:

 it is very simple. For black the opening is called defence because white has move advantage and for white it is attack.

For example Kings Indian Attack (white) or Kings indian defence (black)

Because black has the reacting move makes it not a defence. You're assuming that by default. But default can be dangerously misleading as in the Sicilian Defence.

The SD is a flank counterattack from move #1. It's hardly defensive.  

in chess, the convention is that white openings are attacks and black's are defenses.

The_Ghostess_Lola

There can be a freedom found w/ pieces in black

but slippery is your hold in a need to defend

cup your hands to catch rain over your side

shadows ahead come from attack....as you hide.  

The_Ghostess_Lola

We will not adhere to convention. We will stare it down without regard to the fate that awaits our outcome.

IOW's, don't play defense. Let your white flag fall w/out surrender.

Bishop_g5

I don't know if I have to mention this...

Bobby Fischer once said : " My understanding on chess changed when I realized that I can play for a win with the black pieces "

Many years after him , very few top players accumulated this idea on their own way to play chess. Kasparov was one of them. That's why Garry never played the French offense. It takes a long time before becomes offensive...lol