Who here knows out to mate with KBN vs K?

Anyone here man enough to learn the KBN vs K mate? Just curious

It's not worth it period. 

First time I looked at it, it was somewhat confusing.

Then I looked again a few years later.

Then again a few years later, and etc.

Each time it seemed easier. Now it's very easy. Not much to remember.

R+B vs R has a few different lines to remember.

Q vs R has even more, is very difficult against good defense.

B+B vs N (with the knight on the ideal square) is a little ridiculous IMO. Seems very unlikely, and is very difficult.

My coach wanted me to learn it and i told him no, its a waste of time.  

I know a woman who can give it. Seems like she is more man than me, then.

My coach taught it to me. It was easier than what players who don't know it will say about it.

I think it is not a waste of time to learn it. It requires some calculation and understanding of some key positions. So it is in any case good training. Also I consider it part of chess education. Admittedly the chance of actually having to play it out live is very remote.

I do have seen it at a recent tournament here in Switzerland where a GM played it vs. a WFM (I think). He did not blitz out his moves. But it was obvious that he knew how to do it and what to look out for. She resigned before the mate.

I agree with Tom, a chess player should know every forced mate sooner or later.

I look at it about once a year. On a board. Play through it once which takes about two minutes then the technique is refreshed.

It's of little practical use but compared to the time the average amateur wastes learning opening theory this isn't really worse.

I just learned most of it this morning.  It's tricky, but not as impossible as it seems at first. 

I even tested myself out by playing it out against the engine set at full 2500+ strength, and in all four edges of the board (yup, left, right, upside down, etc.) Gets weirdly fun after awhile - the moves almost become automatic when you're practicing them. 

I figured that it's due time to internalize (meaning play on autopilot, almost no thought necessary) the basic mates, and if I can get this one, the other endgames should be easy.

Yep, that's the starting position in Fundamental Chess Endings that I run against the engine. It's hard!

I looked it up and found this:

"On the other hand, Jeremy Silman includes the checkmate with two bishops but not the bishop plus knight checkmate because he has encountered the latter only once and his friend John Watson has never encountered it "

Why bother?

It's fun to know.  If you can't see the beauty in it, well, you should probably just drop your chess board and books off at Goodwill.

Every now and then in a blitz game, I will underpromote so that I can practice performing this checkmate with limited time on the clock.

Why would you pay a coach and then ignore their advice?

Actually, this one position is absolutely killing me - can one of you guys post a solution?

Here's my attempt. Not at all checked for accuracy. I think it shows the general idea though.

Basically just keep controlling the square to the left and the king will be forced to the right.

One idea that helps me for this mate no matter what the position is, the idea that the knight wants to be on the same color square as the bishop.

So whenever you move the knight, it's usually a pair of moves.

So for example if you have your knight on d4, you look at what other dark squares close by are useful. So from d4 you pick f4, or e5, or something like this.

• You need to know which corner to mate in.
• It's handy to know that doing it from the "wrong corner", where they always run to, is very easy and systematic.
• There are a couple of standard positions. Practice it a bunch of times and it's not that hard.
• Somewhere on youtube there is a video where someone explains it very clearly.
• It is relevant! I had it at least a couple of dozen times in blitz tournaments over 2 decades. Would have cost me a lot if i hadn't been able to do it.

That's perfect! That initial N dance to reposition everything one file over was what I was missing. Thanks!

 With this info, I can do it ALL, from any position, against Stockfish full strength!

-- MAD RESPECT for the help!!! --