Why chess960 is not popular yet at the top level?

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soniasingh_1

It must be due to fear of losing...

soniasingh_1
FallingUp wrote:

You mean Chess 960 right?

yes chess960.. typo mistake.. sorry for that...

soniasingh_1

Viewers also seem to be limited.. It is the fans who decide which way the chess goes.. apparently there is no interest in fans as well..

k_kostov

Regular chess has many "out of the board" considerations to increase the interest in it - those being things that are connected not only with the particular game between two, say, masters being played and the tactical and strategical competition between them, but with chess history, theory development, previous games between those two people or with the same opening, even chess fashion changes if you want, etc. Another reason is that regular chess allows for much more pre-game preparation than chess 960, and that means much more consistency in game results, which is important for a professional player.

ClavierCavalier
k_kostov wrote:

Regular chess has many "out of the board" considerations to increase the interest in it - those being things that are connected not only with the particular game between two, say, masters being played and the tactical and strategical competition between them, but with chess history, theory development, previous games between those two people or with the same opening, even chess fashion changes if you want, etc. Another reason is that regular chess allows for much more pre-game preparation than chess 960, and that means much more consistency in game results, which is important for a professional player.

Wasn't avoiding this prep and relying on in game skills the reason behind Fischer's Chess960?

I think a lot of it has to do with sponsorship, as mentioned earlier.  Some of it probably also has to do with these great players feeling out of their element and naked when all of their years of chess study is thrown out of the window.

k_kostov
ClavierCavalier wrote:

Some of it probably also has to do with these great players feeling out of their element and naked when all of their years of chess study is thrown out of the window.

Their knowledge is retained no matter there's a new type of chess. Regular chess and chess 960 require different kinds of preparation, and if one has invested much time in regular chess and has achieved reasonable success in it, there's no reason to switch to professionally competing in chess 960. As a successful marathon runner wouldn't start competing in sprints. One can't and needn't be good at all sports. It's a matter of choice.

eddysallin

Chess 960 is not chess,nor are the 5/6 other games using chess pieces.

x-5058622868

Is Monopoly with house rules still not Monopoly? Is the Sicilian with all its variations still not the Sicilian?

soniasingh_1
eddysallin wrote:

Chess 960 is not chess,nor are the 5/6 other games using chess pieces.

Why is that? It is a great idea acoording to me..

plutonia

Chess 960 is not chess. It can't be taken seriously. It's just a frivolous attempt to have something different just for the heck of it.

Chess depends on the starting position. The harmonious development of the pieces, the aesthetical and logical value of the position, and the immensity of possible opening systems are things that make chess great.

duck_and_cover

Chess960 is introducing a random element: the starting position. This is against the spirit of the game.

TheGreatOogieBoogie

960 may be fun, but it lacks the precedent and historical value of traditional chess.  Capablanca didn't play his immaculate endgames in 960, Anderssen didn't play the Immortal Game in 960, Kasparov didn't try a faulty anti-computer strategy against Deep Blue playing 960, and you get the picture. 

soniasingh_1
ScorpionPackAttack wrote:

960 may be fun, but it lacks the precedent and historical value of traditional chess.  Capablanca didn't play his immaculate endgames in 960, Anderssen didn't play the Immortal Game in 960, Kasparov didn't try a faulty anti-computer strategy against Deep Blue playing 960, and you get the picture. 

I think I get it..

royalbishop

Money and Fame. Mostly money.

Or if it becomes too popular we might just play that only primarily. Now how are they going to write books on all of those openings. ?Develop Knights to their natural position.... not when it is at a1/h1 or a8/h8. ?Play e4 and maybe that opens a diagonal to your King and the Queen is the corner. How are they going to cover all those random positions. The chapters are going to be so vague.

Also many players have a tough time with Chess itself let alone to watch a GM play Chess 960. How many players are going to take time to study that game as it started off in a random position. I also feel that some of random positions favor White sometimes leaving Black never having a real chance to win unless White makes a mistake.

soniasingh_1
royalbishop wrote:

Money and Fame. Mostly money.

Or if it becomes too popular we might just play that only primarily. Now how are they going to write books on all of those openings. ?Develop Knights to their natural position.... not when it is at a1/h1 or a8/h8. ?Play e4 and maybe that opens a diagonal to your King and the Queen is the corner. How are they going to cover all those random positions. The chapters are going to be so vague.

Also many players have a tough time with Chess itself let alone to watch a GM play Chess 960. How many players are going to take time to study that game as it started off in a random position. I also feel that some of random positions favor White sometimes leaving Black never having a real chance to win unless White makes a mistake.

so armagedon in chess960 would be good?

nebunulpecal

"Capablanca didn't play his immaculate endgames in 960, Anderssen didn't play the Immortal Game in 960..."

 

That's because they didn't have 960 back then. There's no reason why an "immaculate" endgame cannot be played in 960. 

royalbishop

Chess 960 was first created as a learning tool. Maybe they still see it as a learning tool. As a GM how would this help them learn more about playing chess? Now other than money if we had 10 Standard Chess 960 positions that were randomly picked and used in a tournament this could work. Oh the players were given these positions before the start of the tournament. Or have some Universal starting positions. Ca Ching Wink

TheGreatOogieBoogie
nebunulpecal wrote:

"Capablanca didn't play his immaculate endgames in 960, Anderssen didn't play the Immortal Game in 960..."

 

That's because they didn't have 960 back then.

Exactly my point, it lacks historical precedent and therefore isn't as traditional. 

nebunulpecal

That's because the top GMs should throw away most of their opening preparation.

And think about all those thousands of opening books and DVDs... that's a relatively big business within the chess world. Some authors might be left without work...

 

960 is a respectable attempt; its only randomness is before any move is played and it doesn't favor either side. Everything after that is chess as we know it.

rnbqk

I think the main reason for the unpopularity is that castling is way too complicated and unwelcoming.  I am for using starting positions that keep the kings and rooks on the classical locations so castling rule remains the same as the classical game, only knights, bishops and queen are shuffled.