good words. You can tell about your anger in your prayers to The almighty God. He helps you to forgive others.
Principles for Living a Good Life

Birdbrain, I know this is in essence expressing what you had wanted to convey in the other thread. I also know due to the conflict the other thread generated, that you had to strip this topic of the kind of emphasis you originally desired. Just wanted to let you know that the rules are more relaxed if you put it into your blog than in a public forum. So this is perfect in this forum. However, if you also wanted to restart the sort of topic that you had the other day, you could do that as well from your blog.
Cheers.

And you have some editing control of your blog and the posts. (So you could delete a response to your blog that you didn't think was appropriate.)

At no point do I understand why you're forgiving someone, who has done you wrong. Are you saying it is 'unreasonable' to enter into a vicious circle of harm done to you, revenge-seeking and attaining, then reciprocosity? If so, what is "forgiveness" for you {Gods and dictionaries are not required here}, other than a supression of justice? Or, an erasure to one's memory?
Someone has hit me. I could file charges. I could hit them back. I could dislike them, never having to deal with them again. Someone says to me, "Forgive them". But what option is this? What does that mean?

I think that if someone violates my rights, that I have no moral obligation to forgive them. In fact, I am not even helping others if I let it pass. If I don't stand my ground and defend myself, then I am promoting abuse of others by that same person. So I see your point about forgiveness, Trysts.
I have, though, had people in my life that have continuously been verbally abusive, and in other ways, and for my own emotional well-being I have had to forgive them. Not because they deserve it, and not because I am accepting that I had any duty to do it, but simply as a means for me to let go of the negative feelings. I have, though, had to gradually learn how to prevent them from ever having a chance to hurt me again in the future.
BTW, I am prepared to use any force necessary to stop physical abuse of me or my family by others. I speak nicely in chess.com forums, but I understand full well that humans didn't merely evolve from mammals, they still are mammals. Underneath the cultured veneer is still a potentially dangerous enemy. If someone crosses the lines and hits me, they better make it count the first time.
I fully agree with your example, Trysts.

Trysts, it is hard to walk through life bitter and angry all the time because people have hurt you. It is a lot better to feel peaceful, and when you learn to forgive others, you will have more peace in your own life.

Thank you, Timotheous
@ BirdBrain: If you would define "forgiveness" for me, I'll be better at giving you clear ideas on the matter, instead of questions. I hope:)

Trysts, I may not be a Webster's Dictionary, but I will do my best.
Forgiveness, as I understand it, is voluntarily releasing the debt that you feel someone owes you. In monetary terms, if someone owes you $5, and they cannot pay it, you release them from that debt, if you wish to forgive them.
In a different light, if someone spoke a terrible word about you, just to be mean, you can forgive them by releasing the bitterness and resentment that you feel towards them. You can go so far as to speak something kind in return. This may not initally do anything for the person who is confronting you, but it will probably shock them. It is unusual for people to do something good to someone who has done something bad to them.
I put this into practice with my dad, who I had a terrible relationship with as a child. It was quite abusive (not as much physical, but more in derogatory language, etc.). For years, I could not release the bitterness I felt inside - but I wanted to. I didn't want to hold a grudge against him. Finally, I began to practice forgiveness, as if I had already forgiven him. Even though the pain still existed within my heart, I treated my dad as if he had never hurt me.
I remember testifying to my dad at one point in my life, I simply wanted to kill myself. This went on for years - I was full of internal turmoil. Due to things that happened in my childhood, I thought everyone was out to get me. I trusted no one, nothing...there was no safe direction to go. I felt that dying was the only way out. Fortunately, things have changed in my life
When I began to see that, even though I felt bitter on the inside, I treated him as though there was no bitterness. The most amazing thing was that the bitterness began to dissipate. Dad and I created a new bond. I am not saying it is the best relationship in the world - my dad still has plenty of his own issues. That aside, it is miles ahead of what we once had - something I hated.
In short, I practiced forgiveness, and my bitterness melted away.
I hope this helped - the principle of voluntarily releasing a debt that you feel you are owed, such as revenge, retaliation, etc.

Today, 2-8-2011, I want to post about the principle of doing good for the sake of doing good.
In the Boy Scouts, we had a coin and a principle "Do a Good Turn Daily". The idea was that you stuck this certain coin in one of your pant pockets, I believe it was the left one. Before the end of the day, you wanted to spend that coin on doing a good deed. For instance, helping an elderly lady cross a street, returning something that someone dropped or lost, donating to those in need, etc. The coin would be spent by being taken from the left pocket and then placed in the right pocket. The Boy Scout had done his good turn for the day.
The principle is an amazing one. Often, we want to see the world be changed, but it begins with us. I am not saying that you have to buy a special coin and put it in your left pocket, and watch out for damsels in distress! But a good turn could be something as simple as telling someone, "Have a wonderful day!"
Where I work, I interact with customers daily, and it brings great joy to me to have an opportunity to try to uplift them. I purposefully tell corny jokes, be attentive to their needs, and tell them to have a wonderful day as they leave my store. It may be the only opportunity they have during that day to smile.
We have more power in our lives to do amazing things for good, for the sake of doing good. Imagine - if everyone followed this principle, no one would be needing. We would all seek after one another's needs, and no one would be left out.
Today, I challenge you to do a good turn daily. Even if you don't feel like it, take the time to do it. You will feel better afterwards, knowing that you did something that really brightened someone else's day!
Have a wonderful day!

I hope this helped - the principle of voluntarily releasing a debt that you feel you are owed, such as revenge, retaliation, etc.
Yes, well done, and no gods. Human points of view are always more understandable to me, thanks

I don't think that forgiveness is totally necessary. When someone wrongs me, I don't necessarily forgive them, but I am able to let it go. I don't have to get retaliation against them, but I don't have to be buddy-buddy with them, either.
Of course, I always do forgive my wife and child, but those family bonds are far much stronger than some aquaintance who may do something to wrong me.
Of course part of letting go is to realize that the person who wronged you is an idiot and it's likely that everyone else knows it, too.

...
Of course part of letting go is to realize that the person who wronged you is an idiot and it's likely that everyone else knows it, too.

I think forgiveness can only be just, and (is not necessarily alywas just), when the person who has behaved unjustly to you understands/admits his/her own mistake and apologizes. Only then forgiveness could be considered. And that is, considered only.
Other than that, it's like "oh I can't do anything about the fact that my father is/was abusive so it's best I act like nothing happens."
Well, acting like it never happened is a priorily wrong. Like, it's the definition of wrong. Sorry to put it bluntly, but abusive fathers are abusive fathers and there's nothing to ignore about them.
" I know, in some instances, you cannot demonstrate forgiveness, with abusive relationships, etc. But at the least, speak it for your own healing. Forgive the person, and seek to think good thoughts towards that person, thoughts of peace."
What ignorant nonsense is this?
if you walk around giving nonsensical advice about forgiving in abusive relationships, you're no better than those who abuse. And oh yeah, being ignorant is that terrible.

I understand your feelings on this issue. I agree that if someone continues in abuse, it isn't the abusee's responsibility to remain in that situation. My advice comes from being out of the situation for years, and having came back, finding my father in a very rough condition. He wasn't acting like he used to, and I had a choice to either retaliate on him, or treat him the way I wanted to be treated.
If you wait to extend forgiveness until the other party extends forgiveness, sometimes you will never get the opportunity to do so. There is also the concept of giving forgiveness and staying away from a situation - for instance, forgiving a person who has abused you, but not directly confronting them again, knowing that they are still ready to remain abusive towards you. This forum was not posted to advise people to remain in abusive situations. I don't condone abuse. But I do believe in forgiveness - that it is a powerful healing agent for the person who has been through hard situations.
For me personally, if I had never been able to forgive those who hurt me, I would still be an extremely angry person right now. Sometimes, looking back, I realize that I had done wrong also in situations where someone hurt me. For instance, I was in a program as a youth trying to help rehabilitate me. My past caused me to act out - I didn't understand that things would be different there. I was a pretty bad kid, acting out because of abusive situations I had been in before. When I finally learned that I didn't have to continue acting that way, my life changed.
My father has a lot of trouble saying "I love you". It really hurt my feelings each time I would talk to him on the phone, but I purposed to tell him "I love you" after every conversation. He would say, "Ok." That would be it. One day, something changed...he said, "Ok....I love you." It took him a while, but I saw that there was a change in my father. If I had never actively sought to show my father that someone really did care about him, he might have still been under the old false impression that no one cared. Even seeing that I did nice things for him, his skepticism and fear of love dominated his ability to embrace the nice things I was doing for him. I knew he appreciated them, but he had trouble showing it. My constant encouragement gave him strength to say "I love you".

Look, BirdBrain, I have nothing against your personal relationship with anyone, it might work for you, and if it works, then I'm glad. But when you generalize this, and advise people who are in abusive relationships to seek forgiveness, then you're just overreaching.
You know what's the single thing I like about Rihanna, well, other than that she's so hot and everything? It's that she was actually in love, but still didn't forgive and walked out of that hell. She was sorry to do that but she thought she would be responsible for the next girl who waited one more day to call the police.
That's what you do in abusive relationships. You defend yourself, call the police if necessary, seek justice, not forgiveness. Justice.
And this is only about abusive relationships, it's just one small part of unjust behaviour. Mubarak is getting kicked in the &½$ not because people in Egypt are seeking forgiveness. He is getting kicked in there because people seek justice. And in that situation, even calling the police can't help you. In fact in that case police will beat the hell out of you. Anyways. You see my point.
Seek justice. Not forgiveness.

Well, that is fine...if you think justice is better than forgiveness. My wife has a stalker, and he used to abuse her everyday ruthlessly. She has a lifetime EPO against him. I forgive him, and so does she. But we don't put ourselves in that situation of direct confrontation with him.
I see and understand your point on justice - Rihanna experienced similar to what my wife experienced. But we still forgive, because even if they don't want it, it is healthy and helpful to the healing process. Bitterness and anger are not helpful in recovering from abusive relationships. Counsellours will tell you that is part of the healing process - being able to forgive those who have wronged you. Once you can overcome the pain and agony, you are not in a "Groundhog Day" routine - constantly reliving the painful memories, even though they are part of your past. Once my wife was able to forgive the man who hurt her, she was more confident in her own life, and in our relationship. Those past wounds affected us underneath. Little by little, she has improved and grown stronger, thanks to the power in forgiveness.
I would like to begin a series of posts about "Principles for Living a Good Life". These principles have been found to help people with many problems in their lives, and they are not hard to adopt.
The first one I would like to speak about is forgiveness. It is a terrible issue in life that plagues many people, the issue of unforgiveness. Someone does something wrong to us, and we are not satisfied until they get what we think they deserve. This can lead up to fantasies about something bad happening to the individual, even go as far as plotting to have revenge on someone who has done something wrong to us.
But here are some of the benefits of forgiveness -
It takes a burden off of your shoulders. Ultimately, revenge is not the best policy. You cannot wait until you "get yours", and then they want to return the favor, etc. It is a vicious cycle. Considering that you may have multiple people that you are angry at, and harbor unforgiveness towards, this becomes a large part of your life, draining you of energy that could be better spent doing more positive things.
I dealt with anger and unforgiveness for a large part of my life. Issues with my dad (verbal abuse mainly) caused me inwardly to become a very angry young man. I was discouraged - nothing was ever good enough. And I held onto that unforgiveness for years. It was like a rock within me - it felt unmoveable. I even tried to forgive him for a long time, but couldn't. And I couldn't talk about the issues without becoming very angry. Part of that was because I blamed myself for this issue. Finally, I realized that he may have had the power to speak words that hurt me, but he didn't have power over my unforgiveness. I began to practice forgiveness. This is more than simply saying the words - it is also living as if nothing ever happened. I treated my dad as if those things had never happened, and I showed love to him. I would try to encourage him daily.
He is not the same man that he once was. I don't mind being around him at all anymore. He has experienced multiple wounds in his own life, and he simply did not know how to deal with them. He, thankfully, is improving.
If you have unforgiveness in your life, I hope that you can take a moment and begin to forgive this person. I know, in some instances, you cannot demonstrate forgiveness, with abusive relationships, etc. But at the least, speak it for your own healing. Forgive the person, and seek to think good thoughts towards that person, thoughts of peace. It is hard on a person to constantly seek revenge, and it is hard on the blood pressure too! :-)