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My refutations of openings (early pawn sacs)

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ajian


There are a lot of openings out there that need to leave for good. I'll start with a few of them.And you know how i do it if you've seen my refutations to e4.

First, some easy ones. pawn sacs.

Blackmar-diemer gambit


Danish Gambit

From Gambit

The smith-morra is too hard to refute so i'm not going to try.If there are anymore pawn sacs you wnat me to refute, i'll post them in the comments.

 




ajian

The first one's the wing gambit

TheGreatOogieBoogie

The actual refutation of the wing gambit is:



ThrillerFan
RybkaShredder wrote:

Hello? Smith-Morra is impossible to refute

I'm not going to claim "refute", but I always get an EXCELLENT GAME as Black using the Chicago Defense!  The key is don't develop the Bishop to e7 and allow the 12.Na4 garbage.  Against the "Main Line", Black should play the 7 pawn moves, Nc6, Ra7, Rd7, and either 11...Na5 (my preference) or 11...Bb7.  Both are fine for Black, and it's sheerly a matter of personal taste as to why I prefer 11...Na5.

ThrillerFan
RybkaShredder wrote:

Isn't 11...Na5 met by 12. Nxb5! ?

Actually, NO!

12.Nxb5 is a line in the 11...Bb7 variation, which leads to roughly equal results, but against 11...Na5, it's not playable.  White gets no Comp as his Bishop is eliminated.

1.e4 c5 2.d4 cxd4 3.c3 dxc3 4.Nxc3 e6 5.Nf3 d6 6.Bc4 a6 7.O-O b5 8.Bb3 Ra7 9.Qe2 Nc6 10.Be3 Rd7 11.Rac1 (the "main line", 11.Rfd1 and 11.Rad1 are both inferior) Na5!? 12.Nxb5? axb5 13.Qxb5 Nxb3 and White's goose is cooked!

Against 11...Bb7, it's playable because after 12.Nxb5 axb5 13.Qxb5 Na5, White can play 14.Ba4!, and so instead, Black should play 13...Nge7 with a complicated game where Black is slightly better, but he has to make a few "only moves".  If Black knows it, he's fine, but you have to come prepared in order to play this line successfully.  A lot of anti-intuitive moves are necessary by Black.

ajian
3random wrote:

Dude black's play in your From's gambit sucked

have anything better?

ThrillerFan

In response to the two of you preaching greatness for White in the Morra Gambit:

As for 11.Rfd1, the move is toothless.  It does nothing.  Black covers d6 3 times, and all it does it gives Black time to develop with 11...Be7 or 11...Nf6.  Both lead to strong results for Black.

11.Nd4 is White's only legitimate alternative to 11.Rac1.

After 11.Rac1 Na5 12.Nxb5 Nxb3 (12...axb5 13.Qxb5 Nxb3 14.Bb6!) 13.axb3 axb5 14.Qxb5 Bb7, Black is ok with exact play as illustrated below:

ajian

thanks. now i don't have to refute the smith-morra.

I will be trying to refute the king's gambit in the future. (by the way the QG is not a real gambit because white will easily regain his pawn) Also I will try to refute the two-knight's defense in the italian game. Also there will be another forum refuting normal openings (non-sac)

UltraLaser

In all those so called "refutations" the side sacking the pawn played absolutely horrendous moves. Re1 in the morra-smith, seriously? Bg5 is bad too. 

ajian

Like the sicilian dragon, the scandinavian, the caro-kann 4...Nd7 variation and the Grunfeld defence. (the latter will also be very difficult so I will use the fianchetto variation) @vishal kobla Tongue Out

ajian
UltraLaser wrote:

In all those so called "refutations" the side sacking the pawn played absolutely horrendous moves. Re1 in the morra-smith, seriously? Bg5 is bad too. 

it's the danish gambit for one. also show me some "good" moves for the side that sacked pawns.

ajian

@3random 5...Ng4 6.Qe2 not g3

UltraLaser

Danish Gambit my bad. Qb3 is more to the point than 0-0, e.g. Qe7 then 0-0! with black having to tread carefully. 8.Bg5 is just horrible, f4 and e3 are both better squares, but h3 is probably the best move perhaps followed by Bf4. Qb3 is still an option as is Nd4, both of which again probably better than Bg5. And after h6 definitely Bf4 or Be3 instead of Bh4.

DarkKnightLupo

Can you please share your thaughts on the refutation of the marshall-attack in the ruy lopez :)

TheMushroomDealer

@theStarter I'd like to see you try to refute King's gambit. Many have tried and failed -even the best players such as Ivanchuk. There are simply too many sidelines and untried posibilities. After you think that you have found "refutation" then challange me for online unrated chess and just try to beat me :). (I'm not kidding.)

TheGreatOogieBoogie

In Chess white wins by force in the following manner:



Ben_Dubuque

ajian please don't attempt a refutation of the KG, look what happened to Fischer

DarkKnightLupo

@TheGreatOogieBoogie, lol what happens after d4 onthe 6th move for black? :) 

ajian
3random wrote:
ajian wrote:
3random wrote:

Dude black's play in your From's gambit sucked

have anything better?

 



Why g3 and not the simple d3, e3, Nc3, Bd2, and 0-0-0?

ajian
TheGreatOogieBoogie wrote:

In Chess white wins by force in the following manner:

 



Because black will definetely not see Qa5+