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who is better?

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aman_makhija

Here was a position from one of my games. In this position black blundered by playing c6? Nb4! Rd3+?? Nxd3 and resigned. But the question is: who is better here and why.

Ps. I'm only an intermidiate player and I'm sorry if this is a stupid question.

EDIT: Actually white played kc3 here before black played c6? (read comments 2,3.)

learning2mate

The movement is not possible, the knight is pinned to the king. C6 wins the knight in that position.

aman_makhija

Sorry, white played Kc3, then black played c6? It was white's turn, actually.

learning2mate

Difficult to say for me. I prefer the rook, but black will have to act fast before white starts to roll the queenside pawns into a promotional threat. Kc3 c6 Nb4 Rd1 is what I'd play with black there.

aman_makhija

Wasn't c6 a mistake? after c6 Nb4 Rd1 there's Nxc6+.

learning2mate

Yes, but then the rook has access to whites back rank, taking advantage of whites slow pieces and spread out pawns. Black needs to try and quickly capture a few white kingside pawns and have a pawn race, using the rook as a suicide on the first white pawn that threatens to promote and then queen first. Its not easy, but I prefer an active defense to a passive one.

aman_makhija

Ok thanks for the ideas!

But even if you play Rd1 how exactly do you plan to pick up his pawns?

Isn't Re8-e2 better?

learning2mate

Just swing the rook over- h1, g1, etc until you can eat the pawn(s).

aman_makhija

I don't think that's so easy.

White can defend with h3,g3,f4,h4, etc. Instead of Rd1 Re8-e2 is much better. now you can eat all the pawns.

learning2mate

Doesn't matter how many pawn moves white makes on the kingside, black will win them. White can't stop it and must play Queenside.

aman_makhija

Fine, but it white can eat them much faster if his rook is on the second rank not the first. Black rooks are strongest on the second rank!

learning2mate

My line directly gets blacks rook into whites back lines. You put to much emphasis on starting at the second rank instead of the first in my opinion. It really doesn't matter, you just go after the h and g pawns and run the H pawn down. For that goal, first or second rank are not important.

aman_makhija
 



learning2mate

Now come on, you aren't even playing best moves for white. After Kc3 Kd6 b4, discourage the a5 move, then if c6 Nf4, looking to go to D3 and protect the f2 pawn and e1 invasion square. Black will have difficulty breaking in. My route is a quick and assured for black getting the rook into the first rank. Not saying Kd6 isn't good, I just prefer to get my rook back there immediately before white can possibly defend against it or slow it down enough.

aman_makhija

@ FirebandX,

Fine, in the second diagram it took three moves:1. Kc3Kd62. a4Re83. b4 Re2

In the first diagram it took nine moves: 1. Kc3Kd62. a4c63. Nb4a54. Nd3Kc75. b4axb4+6. Nxb4Rd17. a5Rh1 8.h3 Rh2 Meanwhile white's a5 pawn became a menace.

maybe you can pick up the pawns both ways but overall Re8-e2 is faster than Rd1.

aman_makhija
learning2mate wrote:

Now come on, you aren't even playing best moves for white. After Kc3 Kd6 b4, discourage the a5 move, then if c6 Nf4, looking to go to D3 and protect the f2 pawn and e1 invasion square. Black will have difficulty breaking in. My route is a quick and assured for black getting the rook into the first rank. Not saying Kd6 isn't good, I just prefer to get my rook back there immediately before white can possibly defend against it or slow it down enough.

After Kd6, there are two many pieces on the d-file. it takes too long to get to d1. e2 is a better square. And why will I ever play c6 and force your knight to go to its best defensive squares e3, or d3.

Even in my first diagram, i only made white play b4 after a5 and get his knight of the d-file to illustrate a point. If that was what happened in the game, white would play the much stronger: 2.b4!! That way he doesn't have to wait for a5 and bring his knight back to support b4. The d-file would remain closed.

learning2mate

My line got the rook to d1, it's forced. I played your lines and suggested better moves for white and showed a way for white to delay or block the black rook invasion. After Kc3 Kd6 in your lines, can you show me how the rook goes to e2/second rank and how it is faster/more effective than my original line?

Martin0

I tried playing on a bit against myself. It obviously don't prove anything, but to me it felt like it was a bit difficult for black actually. Whites position is quite solid.



chesskingdreamer

The end position of your analysis has got to be a win for white.

learning2mate

FM, for my benefit could you show or demonstrate the win in martin0 final position? I am very interested in strong players ability to evaluate positions and intuition on who is winning in them. Thanks.