Faulty Tactic

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Avatar of Chessbovine

I had tactic #77196 in puzzle rush https://www.chess.com/puzzles/problem/77196/practice

I played Qh3 with the idea Qg2# next move but I got it marked as wrong and got a strike. The solution it wants is to play Qg4+, Qg2#, but both Qg4+ and Qh3 are forced mate in 2, so both solution should be equal.

I can understand why the engine would think one is better, but it really isn't, as it doesn't matter if I lose a knight mating in two moves or keep it and mate in two moves

Avatar of jdcannon

Thanks! I will remove this bad boy. 

Avatar of Chessbovine

Or it could be altered so that the pawn move would cause a check, like if the king was uncastled

Avatar of Chessbovine
endgame347 hat geschrieben:
Chessbovine wrote:

I had tactic #77196 in puzzle rush https://www.chess.com/puzzles/problem/77196/practice

I played Qh3 with the idea Qg2# next move but I got it marked as wrong and got a strike. The solution it wants is to play Qg4+, Qg2#, but both Qg4+ and Qh3 are forced mate in 2, so both solution should be equal.

I can understand why the engine would think one is better, but it really isn't, as it doesn't matter if I lose a knight mating in two moves or keep it and mate in two moves

 

Id of gone Qg4+ and I'm sure 99% of others would too.

That's probably true, but still both solution are equally right and puzzles are supposed to have only one right answer

Avatar of Elroch

There is an argument for having at least some credit for moves that mate more slowly (eg a mate in 3 versus a mate in 2). There is also an argument for giving credit to moves that are winning, but not such a large amount of material, although it is a tricky point when these are good (sometimes they are even better than the "best" move, because of being simpler, or possibly quicker to finish.

It could be argued puzzles are separate from practical chess, but if the main purpose is to improve chess, the objective should be as close as possible to that of practical chess.

Avatar of KelticFrost88

Nevertheless, the puzzle needs to be removed.

Avatar of Chessbovine
Elroch hat geschrieben:

There is an argument for having at least some credit for moves that mate more slowly (eg a mate in 3 versus a mate in 2). There is also an argument for giving credit to moves that are winning, but not such a large amount of material, although it is a tricky point when these are good (sometimes they are even better than the "best" move, because of being simpler, or possibly quicker to finish.

It could be argued puzzles are separate from practical chess, but if the main purpose is to improve chess, the objective should be as close as possible to that of practical chess.

But in this case it's not M3 vs M2 or M6 vs +20, it's M2 vs M2 which are equal as both win in two moves, and it doesn't matter if material is lost along the way.

Though I also do agree that finding forced mate in three when there is mate in two, especially after a long sequence that you got right should not necessarily count as incorrect, as you still made use of the tactic as opposed to those where you completely lose the advantage when you make anything but the best move but the argument that it's something different from practical chess is also quite valid

Avatar of chadnilsen
endgame347 wrote:
Chessbovine wrote:

I had tactic #77196 in puzzle rush https://www.chess.com/puzzles/problem/77196/practice

I played Qh3 with the idea Qg2# next move but I got it marked as wrong and got a strike. The solution it wants is to play Qg4+, Qg2#, but both Qg4+ and Qh3 are forced mate in 2, so both solution should be equal.

I can understand why the engine would think one is better, but it really isn't, as it doesn't matter if I lose a knight mating in two moves or keep it and mate in two moves

 

Id of gone Qg4+ and I'm sure 99% of others would too.

I'd have

Avatar of MainframeSupertasker

It seems forced and STRONG. I wouldve gone for it. but logically this should be removed.

Avatar of Waredude
Chessbovine wrote:
endgame347 hat geschrieben:
Chessbovine wrote:

I had tactic #77196 in puzzle rush https://www.chess.com/puzzles/problem/77196/practice

I played Qh3 with the idea Qg2# next move but I got it marked as wrong and got a strike. The solution it wants is to play Qg4+, Qg2#, but both Qg4+ and Qh3 are forced mate in 2, so both solution should be equal.

I can understand why the engine would think one is better, but it really isn't, as it doesn't matter if I lose a knight mating in two moves or keep it and mate in two moves

 

Id of gone Qg4+ and I'm sure 99% of others would too.

That's probably true, but still both solution are equally right and puzzles are supposed to have only one right answer

I think it is the right answer because it comes with check, so he can’t respond with any checks that would delay the mate. 

Avatar of Chessbovine
Waredude hat geschrieben:
Chessbovine wrote:
endgame347 hat geschrieben:
Chessbovine wrote:

I had tactic #77196 in puzzle rush https://www.chess.com/puzzles/problem/77196/practice

I played Qh3 with the idea Qg2# next move but I got it marked as wrong and got a strike. The solution it wants is to play Qg4+, Qg2#, but both Qg4+ and Qh3 are forced mate in 2, so both solution should be equal.

I can understand why the engine would think one is better, but it really isn't, as it doesn't matter if I lose a knight mating in two moves or keep it and mate in two moves

 

Id of gone Qg4+ and I'm sure 99% of others would too.

That's probably true, but still both solution are equally right and puzzles are supposed to have only one right answer

I think it is the right answer because it comes with check, so he can’t respond with any checks that would delay the mate. 

There are no moves after Qh3 that would somehow prevent or delay checkmate on the next move, thus it's just as good as Qg4+

Avatar of Waredude

Oh yeah. Facepalm. Thought Queen was down a square for white