aggressive, tactical and open "system" to deal with hypermoderns?

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tygxc

#23
Here is a game where it was enough
https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1066991 

gik-tally

B1zmark said "try this system"

um... it's CLOSED. i don't want pawns in my way. i want to open things up OR get my pieces developed in an open space and coordinated. i'm thinking there's really no way to meet hypermoderns on my terms, and after losing about 9 out of my last 10 games, the frustration is unbearable. i still say putzes are sandbagging me, but i can't prove it

 

play hypermodern with hypermodern? like as in fire with fire?

more like get those pawns the eff out of my way so I can wiggle my pieces towards targets. it's not how I want to play, but if it's the only way to be active without an oppressive pawn maze in the way, i'll settle. 

 

i really wish people would put more effort into categorizing openings by aggression, mobility, double edgedness, and positional etc. that's the problem, i can look replies to the pirc up, but they're useless without the "underlying form" of what a variation is trying to do. i want tactics... tactics in the open. without that, i'm miserable. my lack of positional sense is extremely frustrating when i look at a position where i'm tripping over everything trying to make something happen, yet not knowing what went wrong. i only trust stockfish for blunder checking. i find its aggression  to be seriously lacking in the opening, at least.

gik-tally

Hey, i play the scandi. i know how to counter the 2.e5 advance, you go 2… c5. Then you can go Bf5/Bg4, e6, Nc6, Qb6, 0-0-0, Nge7-f5/g6 and your position is a comfortable IMPROVED french.

 

that's what i've been playing a couple months now and have actually STUDIED it! i have that variation all booked up and am doing much better in it. right now, 3.d4 and 3.Nc3 are annoying me. i do not like that the ONLY way to meet Nc3 is with the knight trade and Qxd4. i thought I quit that scandinavian!  bring my queen out just so it can get chased? not liking it. i played an unsound 3...e5? and actually beat a 1700 in 17 moves, but both that and the can opener knight sac i used to get into his castle were about +5 bad, but the pressure made my opponent crack.

 

having theory helps a lot even if i can't remember it. as there is so much repetition in the "sicilian" line, i now have a set of ideas, like Nh6!? i can draw on even if sometimes use a move in the wrong place. anything's better than "let's see if this works".

gik-tally

QUOTE: "that's what that stupid grandmaster said" ++ Maybe that grandmaster is not stupid...

when you charge someone for information and don't provide it, yes, you ARE a complete idiot and a thief too as far as i'm concerned. I didn't buy the book to be told "good luck with that sucker" that's why i'm rolling my own theory from amateur games now. i'm concentrating on the stuff i'll actually see and getting all that theory. my advanced scandinavian book came from amateur games.. the ones grandmasters have contempt for. they have disdain for amateurs, and they can all disappear forever as far as i'm concerned. they do more harm than good like, for example, brainwashing all of you into the false belief that gambits are unsound when the big ones tend to have a 10% performance edge at the amatueur level... you know, the whole reason i bought those useless books. that's not unsound! that's outright literal decimation! you have been fed a lie!

gik-tally

QUOTE: ++ You never lose because of the opening, you lose because you make tactical mistakes

you are impossibly wrong there! OMG you have no clue how wrong you are! openings are so important to me because i get tripped up so easy IN THE OPENING! there's reasons why my king's gambit games are something like a winning 55%, but i'm only 10% in hypermodern openings. tactics are irrelevant when you're tripping over your own pieces and getting pushed all over the board because of it.

 

if the opening is lost, the game is too unless my opponent blunders, or at least gives me opportunities for tactics. i'm all over tactics! it's all i do. i'm at peace with my limitations. positional concepts are pure nonsense to me. they are mostly just empty words short of concepts like capture towards the center and attack on the flanks in closed positions. otherwise, if i can't visualize it, it doesn't exist. i model ideas visually. position is invisible ether.

gik-tally

"i could not get through a single pawn ending chapter in any of my 3 chess books"
++ Chess is a game. It is meant to be fun. If you have no fun studying endings, then do not.

it wasn't about fun or lack thereof. writing books and studying the theory is tedious, but it also works like positional concepts don't. that's my point. no amount of "blah blah blah" from three different sources could help me visualize. it took a tutorial to get it by memorization which i forgot a month or two later when i needed a pawn ending anyways.

sndeww
1983B-Boy wrote:

B1zmark said "try this system"

um... it's CLOSED. i don't want pawns in my way. 

[snip]

you can try exchanging pawns if you want to make it "open". Although im not sure there will be tactics. 

White is not playing in a hypermodern style by any means.

ThrillerFan
1983B-Boy wrote:

"i could not get through a single pawn ending chapter in any of my 3 chess books"
++ Chess is a game. It is meant to be fun. If you have no fun studying endings, then do not.

it wasn't about fun or lack thereof. writing books and studying the theory is tedious, but it also works like positional concepts don't. that's my point. no amount of "blah blah blah" from three different sources could help me visualize. it took a tutorial to get it by memorization which i forgot a month or two later when i needed a pawn ending anyways.

 

Clearly you have no idea how this game works.

 

Sure chess is fun, but it takes hard work to succeed.  To just brush off stuff like endings because you find them boring is utter failure.

 

You need to be able to handle open, closed, and semi-open positions.  You cannot force an open position in all cases.

 

It is hilarious that you whine and bi*ch and bellyache like a 2 year old over Black playing an opening that you don't like!  Cry me a freaking river!  SMH!

gik-tally

OK... I just played this game earlier today and wanted to share it as proof that position is a nightmare for me. moves that are correct, look hideously fugly to me. this is why i need booking up. i can memorize without understanding. i've added notes so you can hear what's wrong with my thinking. then, i want to share a game where i ignored book and waxed a 1700 in 17

 

Scandinavian Modern (1537 vs 1464) 

1.e4 d5?! 

2.exd5 Nf6 

3.c4?! e6 

4.dxe6 Bxe6 

5.Nf3 Bd6? +1.92 (5…c5 +0.65 puts a useless pawn in the way)

6.d4 c6?! +2.42 (6…Bb4+ +2.02 I don’t want to trade my bishops)

7.Bd3 O-O 

8.O-O a6? +3.29 (8…Bg4 +2.26 moving my piece a second time instead of following …a6 with 9…b5 to open the queenside for mobility)

9.Nc3 b5 

10.c5 Bc7 

11.Bg5 h6 

12.Bh4 g5?! +3.50 (12…Nbd7 +2.87 cuts my queen off from the d file and keeps her from mating on h2)

13.Bg3 Bxg3 

14.hxg3! Qd7? +5.38 (14…Nbd7 +3.63 same as #12, was thinking of getting queen on g3)

15.Re1 Nd5? +7.15 (15... Kg7 +5.47 is a totally passive move. I hate it!)

16.Nxd5 Bxd5 

17.Be4? Bxe4 

18.Rxe4 Qf5 

19.Re5 Qg6? +6.38 (19…Qg4 +5.27 is begging for 20.Nh2 and losing a tempo in an already fugly situation)

20.Qe2?? Nd7 

21.Re7 Nf6?? +7.02 (21…Rfd8 +3.91 I hate it! Defensive move with attacks on white’s castle getting further and further away)

22.Re1?? Nd5? +4.67 (22.Rfe8 +3.02 I don’t want to trade!!! I like my rook on f for a pawn push. Simplifying = giving all one’s weapons away here)

23.Re5? a5 

24.Qe4?? b4?? +6.76 (24...Qxe4 +0.87 I don’t want to trade!!!!!!! I’m desperately looking for the only play I can make happen at this point) 

25.Qxg6+! fxg6 

26.Re6 Rf6 

27.Re8+?! Rxe8 

28.Rxe8+ Kf7 

29.Ra8 Nc7?? +8.69 ( 29... Nc3 +5.38 I didn’t calculate for white being unable to stop my pawn. I hate pawns… stupid little things that get in the way, or me into trouble with everyone who sees the invisible mumbo jumbo of position)

30.Ra7 enough's enough... resign 1-0

 

 

regarding the carokann... i actually played a hillbilly and won just doing what seemed right. i wasn't following book at all. it's a really good suggestion as it features my love of sacking my king's bishop on f7 for castling rights muzio/krejcik style. i went through all the gambits in the caro and sorted everything by 1600-2000 popularity with performance stats and evaluations if anyone's interested.

 

P.S. i actually won both of my hillbilly carokanns. i beat a 2...d5 1657 in 35, and 2...a5 1640 in 27! that's just doing what comes natural. i'm surprised. i would have bet against a pair of +200 scalps in the caro just winging it. it's like the monte carlo french, i guess. it just feels and plays right like the stonewall doesn't for me.

 

the stats for the hillbilly are terrible at 42:54 in a million some games, but right now, i'm 100% against higher rated opponents in it. i was starting to look into the maroczy, but if i continue to perform above average in the redneck, why quit?

gik-tally

i'm surprised to see that my record in 1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Nf6 3. Nc3 is:

3...c6 35% at 20

3...Nxd5 61% at 18 games... huh! I hate seeing this variation, but i'm stomping

3...e5 4 wins 2 losses at 10 games. i play this to avoid having my queen chased in the Qxd5 variation as i quit playing 2...Qxd5 for the marshall decades ago.

i caught this 1704 in 17 moves with my "can opener gambit"

 

1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Nf6 3. Nc3 e5 4. Bb5+ Nbd7 5. Bxd7+ Bxd7 6. Nge2 Bd6 7. O-O e4 8. h3 Ng4

the can opener gambit +5.6, but not unsound this day!

9. hxg4 Qh4 10. Ng3 Bxg4 was planning for 10.g3 Qh3 11.(?) ...Bxg4 & 12...Bf3

11. Qe1 O-O 12. Qxe4 Rfe8 13. Qc4 Bxg3 14. fxg3 Qxg3 15. d3 Bh3 16. Rf2 Re1+ 17. Rf1 Qxg2# 

delicious victory after a few miserable positional clusterflops before it that day. i was not in the mood for more floundering and tripping over my own pieces, but apparently, i'm doing great in the main lines and just remembering the really bad games.

and playing such "unsound" attacks is how I claim scalps. my gambit was unsound, but my opponent's replies to it were "unsounderer"

 

IHaveTHEChessSkill

against the pirc play 160 attack or early f4

3141516a
play an early f4 against fianchettos and along with your big center and upcoming pawn storm it’s very unbalanced at least
tygxc

#35
Yes, as soon as black plays ...g6 the most aggressive is either O-O with f2-f4-f5 or O-O-O with h2-h4-h5

Devilish_Bad_Games

We are in the same boat it seems. At first I played monte karlo too against french, but then I  started to play this ''gambit system''  by just giving up E4 pawn against caro-Kann and french for some development, imbalance and hopefully a nice attack.

2.b3 d5

3.Bb2 dxe4

4.Nc3 ...

5. Qe2



https://www.chess.com/openings/Caro-Kann-Defense-Euwe-Attack

https://www.chess.com/openings/French-Defense-Horwitz-Papa-Ticulat-Gambit

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjpObGVv1YA&t=187s&ab_channel=ChessWeeb

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1lj8JqinB8&ab_channel=LightSquares

(I prefer Nf3 and Qe2 in both openings if they dont defend their pawn I take it and settle for somewhat interesting and unbalanced position if they defend, then I play f3, after exf3, Nxf3 a kingside pawn storm starting with h6 or strike in the center with D4 push)

 

 

Devilish_Bad_Games



 

PawnTsunami

First of all, the French and Caro-Kann are hardly "hypermodern" defenses.  Both of those lay claim to the center immediately (i.e. not a hypermodern approach).

Second, there is no "universal" system that you can play against anything Black plays that will get you a good position.  You can try system openings (KIA, London, Colle, Torre) but Black still has ways to meet each of those that will likely frustrate you.

Finally, and this is the key point, you are not losing games because of the opening.  You are losing games because you hang pieces.  Black could play the Borg and you will still lose if you hang pieces left and right.  If you follow general opening principles and avoid hanging pieces, you will end up with good positions against all of the hypermodern defenses.

jmpchess12

Sounds like you need to learn how to build an attack when your opponent doesn't intentionally weaken their position (a la the king's gambit accepted which is a good line for black but very sharp). The french, caro, and pirc rarely lead to peaceful games unless white indulges with peaceful play.

French: Milner-Barry gambit probably strikes the right balance between being aggressive and respectable. Could also try Nc3 stuff but might get frustrated against the Rubinstein. 

Caro: Tal variation

Price: go for the quick queen side castling lines. 

 

 

TorrejosJames

Message me on my Gmail: venjosojerrot@gmail.com and I will send you chess openings repertoire for black and it's completely free.

gik-tally

again, it's not pieces that hurt me in games, it's position. i intended to share a nightmare game against a 1200-1300 who wrecked my castle, my queenside AND bishop pair before move 10 and i just wanted to quit right there with all my pieces uncoordinated. i get into positions where my pieces are all on bad squares and trip worse and worse trying to make things happen. 

 

little pawn moves drive me nuts. i despise pawns! they are the cause of maybe half of my positional agony, like a day or two ago... i had an advantage and totally blew it trying to crack open a fianchetto with an extra pawn on f5. i threw everything at it and never opened it up. that's the kind of foofy positional stuff i just can't wrap my head around. 

 

i deal in pieces... big "predictable" moves.

 

OK... maybe i should rephrase my question... what are strong attacking lines that rip the center open so one can actually play some chess?

 

as to the f4 suggestion, i love it in king's gambit, but hated it in the sicilian. grand prix is not for me... smith morra and nothing but, for life. when i'm booked up in it, i kick much butt.

 

as to black repertoire... i wanted to play the albin, but at = stats, it's not the strongest gambit. that, and i'd need a lot more because it seems like i never see queen's gambit anymore. no point in studying openings one never uses.

 

as to hypermoderns, my understanding is that they involve 1 square pawn pushes. push 2, and you're not a hypermodern. as the carokann only pushes to c6, that's as hypermodern as pirc, modern & fianchettos etc. it's just a different push. i'm defining by first pawn move by the way. the french pushes to d5 most of the time, but it starts with that e6 that puts me in a bad mood whenever i see it. i swear i'm losing games out of frustration of drawing black 3 times in a row and/or playing half a dozen games in a row of nothing but openings i hate. there's gonna be stonewalling happening there.

 

if anyone knows of a resource that really tells you how openings play, i'd be happy to do some homework, but in trying to pick a repertoire, i can't find good descriptions of any opening anywhere. that's a lot of time chasing dead ends and question marks.

TorrejosJames

Bruh, my black repertoire against e4 covers many lines that would lead you to wining position quickly.

 

If you need a strong attacking lines that rip of the center then this would be the good choice for you.

I carefully analyzed the position where opponents they hard to understand.