Colle System

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Tnk64ChessCourse

How do you recommend black to play against the Colle system. There's a girl at my chess club who plays it and I like to attack and play for an advantage in the opening.

CarlMI

1. d4 c5  should throw her off track.  Then steer into a Benoni/Benko or take the d pawn depending on her play.

Tnk64ChessCourse
CarlMI wrote:

1. d4 c5  should throw her off track.  Then steer into a Benoni/Benko or take the d pawn depending on her play.


Unfortunately she reaches it by playing 1. Nf3, oh and I should have mentioned, she generally plays the Colle-Zukertort System.

yusuf_prasojo

I'm against the idea of playing the Benoni/Benko after 1.d4 c5, because the Benoni/Benko is even more difficult to play. In the Colle, Black's theoretical problem is the hemmed queenside bishop because of ...e6 but in the Benoni 2.d5 will hem in the knight and probably the rook and the bishop too.

The Colle is effective in the lower level because the player has a simple idea, which is to attack the kingside with the bishop. Other advantage is the passive but "solid" White's pawn structure that will invite Black's reckless attack.

There are many ways to fight the Colle and Colle-Zukertort (Actually, Black should be happy to see White gives up the initiative by playing passive move such as 3.e3). But the easy ones are:

[1] Force White to drop the Colle, or Play ...Bg4 or ...Bf5 (by delaying ...e6). Examples are:

1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 d5 3.e3 g6!! (Here ...Bg4 or ...Bf5 is not important)

1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 d5 3.e3 c5!

1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 d5 3.e3 c6

[2] Don't let your kingside becomes difficult to defend (the same idea with playing against the KID). You can do this by removing your knight from f6 square (with ...Nfd7 and following up with ...f6 or ...f5). You can do this "passive" move safely because White has also done the "passive" move with 3.e3.

[3] Take over the initiative to build a strong center, and don't push your pawns more than the fourth rank (and no more than 2 pawns in the fourth rank). Prepare your pawn/piece to replace the ones in the center if White forces an exchange. At the same time, develop all of your pieces and only attack after you ready (including saving your king first).

yusuf_prasojo

To make point [2] clearer, here is a line where you don't deviate from the Colle-Zukertort, but play its classical mainline, but play it correctly with ...Nfd7 (tho it is still difficult because Black still has to defend):

CarlMI

Obviously I think the Benoni is fully playable, especially since Black has won in World Championship play.  Its far better for working at an attack from the beginning than allowing White the nomal Colle fortress.

If she starts 1. Nf3 all the better.  1. Nf3 c5 just be prepared to play a Sicilian after 2. e4...

yusuf_prasojo
CarlMI wrote:

Obviously I think the Benoni is fully playable, especially since Black has won in World Championship play.  Its far better for working at an attack from the beginning than allowing White the nomal Colle fortress.

If she starts 1. Nf3 all the better.  1. Nf3 c5 just be prepared to play a Sicilian after 2. e4...


You forgot that the original question didn't come from a master-level player.

1.Nf3 c5 2.c4 and you get the English, an unfavorable opening for many players, especially attacking players such as the original poster who ask the question :) But of course every Black player has the risk to get 1.c4 :)

To add to the lines I've suggested previously:

1.Nf3 d4 2.d5 Nf6 3.e3 g6!! tho it is a favourable Gruendfeld variation, this defense is more suitable for advanced players.

1.Nf3 d4 2.d5 Nf6 3.e3 c5! is what I will play, forcing White to drop the Colle (tho I'm not afraid of playing the C-Z)

rrrttt

Nf3 g6 leads to King's Indian type positions

CarlMI

I'm not afraid of the C-Z either but the original poster wanted something that was not a Colle.  Any opening requires study and effort.  While he is not a master, neither is his opponent.

rrrttt

And there's always

Sceadungen

Just play d6 and Fianchetto the Kings Bishop that will meet anything really.

d6 takes away the e5 square, stopping that Ne5 caper, it also prepares e5 when ready, g6 blunts the bishop on d3.

Works for me.

I once played a Colle player who wanted a few grading points off me by drawing I won in 146 moves.  

JuicyJ72

I play the Colle, and as white I have three branches depending on what black does.  There's the standard move order where I will play the C-Z.  If black plays the bishop to f5 or g4 then I play c4-Qb3 and attack the weakened light squares on the queenside.  Then there's the KID which I either play clasically, keep the C-Z, or play a Torre attack depending on my mood.  On both sides one has to be somewhat flexible.  As black I'd probably go with Bf5 since that'll take white out of the Colle which they may not want and gives good play.  Or else the KID if that floats your boat.  One more thing, if black is coy and pay Nf6, d6, Then I'll play Nc3 and see if I can goad them into a Pirc. 

chuckg99
jlueke wrote:

I play the Colle, and as white I have three branches depending on what black does.  There's the standard move order where I will play the C-Z.  If black plays the bishop to f5 or g4 then I play c4-Qb3 and attack the weakened light squares on the queenside.  Then there's the KID which I either play clasically, keep the C-Z, or play a Torre attack depending on my mood.  On both sides one has to be somewhat flexible.  As black I'd probably go with Bf5 since that'll take white out of the Colle which they may not want and gives good play.  Or else the KID if that floats your boat.  One more thing, if black is coy and pay Nf6, d6, Then I'll play Nc3 and see if I can goad them into a Pirc. 


 When I've essayed the C-Z, I play the same way, except that I use the London instead of the Torre.

jarkov

if you play the KID or grunfeld I think its very easy. whenever you can fianchetto your kingside bishop against the colle youre going to stunt their attack before it ever can start.

now there could be some move order tricks, but most people that play the colle are just trying to duck theory and not take it on (but beware) .. I think 1.Nf3 is the hardest 1st move to meet.

 

ps, if you want to see a funny chess vid making fun of the colle system check this out

http://www.youtube.com/user/ChessTeacherJoe#p/u/3/pi7oHAeJ5zU