It's amazing, shepi and CS can't find lines against the Parham, so they resort to using databases that only have like 4 games in them. Helzeth, why aren't they on the list?
It's amazing, shepi and CS can't find lines against the Parham, so they resort to using databases that only have like 4 games in them. Helzeth, why aren't they on the list?
I also used the DB that you used lol.
However, you make a good point (the one we were making to you when you used one with just 17 games), so I need to ask a question to all of you:
Does anyone have access to Chessbase or Fritz13's databases? If so could you post the results for the parham and ruy lopez here. Hopefully those major DB's have more than 4 games.
And Gavinator, when you say that I lost to whatupyodog, you are using a database of 2 games (which is less than 4):
50% - White win
0% - Draw
50% - Black win
You should note that in every database given the ruy lopez scores better than this.
Fine print: Given the past few posts, you might think I like the ruy lopez. I actually play 1.d4. I am just trying to show that openings that are considered sound are better than the parham.
More fine print: Gavinator is right that the ruy has a higher draw % than the parham, and in his database (only) the parham wins more than the ruy. Nevertheless, even in his 17 game database the ruy scores better because most of the draws the ruy creates would have been wins for black in the parham. It's better to draw than lose in my opinion, and I believe most people will agree with this.
I think that databases aren't a very good thing to test the Parham, because that:
1. There is no actual defined Parham theory.
2. There is many people who play it for the 4-move mate then get crushed after.
3. There is just a lack of games, nobody has found more than 20 games or so in a single databases, while many of these databases have thousands of Ruy Lopez Games.
P.S.- I didn't try to find a database where the Parham won more than others. I literally searched "Chess Opening Explorer", and the chessgames.com came up first, but you have to pay for full access, in chess365 there was more games and you didn't have to pay for full access. That's the DB I always use, I didn't find one for the Parham.
Somehow I think I am going to side with not only the better player, but the more expierienced person, the engines, GM's, and my own gut feeling, and say this opening is a POS (for those who don't know that acronym google it.)
Seems like typical opening results. I'll admit that it scores better for white than the parham does.
Even in Gavinator's DB the ruy scores better than the parham, and his has to be the worst DB.
Ruy - scores 55.7%
Parham - scores 52.95%
And that is the only database where white scores more than 50% with the parham.
Note - % is not win %. Instead it is the % score.
% = Win % + (1/2 x Draw %)
That's through move 5, so Gavinator can't say it includes people who don't know any lines.
Chess tempo
Parham score = 37.5%
Ruy score = 56.6%
I think they are starting to believe us. The Parham is bad.
Chess.com
Parham score = 12.5%
Ruy score = 57.25%
chessgames.com
ruy score = 56.8%
Parham score = 36.4%
CS, add one more move at least. At least one of the white wins was 2... Ke7.
That's why, I only used the players who played 2... Nc6
Also, ruy I was going mainline through 5. 0-0.
Without a paid membership I can't go any further on the parham, there aren't enough games.
All of the other DB's except chessgames.com I went through 5. 0-0 and 5. Ne2.
I don't like it either, but when I went through 3. Bb5 and 2. Qh5 Gavi was complaining that low rated players were skewing the DB's.
It's amazing, shepi and CS can't find lines against the Parham, so they resort to using databases that only have like 4 games in them. Helzeth, why aren't they on the list?
Gavinator I found just relized why it sounds like you are on some really good stuff... you are a Libertarian.
It's amazing, shepi and CS can't find lines against the Parham, so they resort to using databases that only have like 4 games in them. Helzeth, why aren't they on the list?
I also used the DB that you used lol.
However, you make a good point (the one we were making to you when you used one with just 17 games), so I need to ask a question to all of you:
Does anyone have access to Chessbase or Fritz13's databases? If so could you post the results for the parham and ruy lopez here. Hopefully those major DB's have more than 4 games.
And Gavinator, when you say that I lost to whatupyodog, you are using a database of 2 games (which is less than 4):
50% - White win
0% - Draw
50% - Black win
You should note that in every database given the ruy lopez scores better than this.
Fine print: Given the past few posts, you might think I like the ruy lopez. I actually play 1.d4. I am just trying to show that openings that are considered sound are better than the parham.
More fine print: Gavinator is right that the ruy has a higher draw % than the parham, and in his database (only) the parham wins more than the ruy. Nevertheless, even in his 17 game database the ruy scores better because most of the draws the ruy creates would have been wins for black in the parham. It's better to draw than lose in my opinion, and I believe most people will agree with this.
I think that databases aren't a very good thing to test the Parham, because that:
1. There is no actual defined Parham theory.
2. There is many people who play it for the 4-move mate then get crushed after.
3. There is just a lack of games, nobody has found more than 20 games or so in a single databases, while many of these databases have thousands of Ruy Lopez Games.
P.S.- I didn't try to find a database where the Parham won more than others. I literally searched "Chess Opening Explorer", and the chessgames.com came up first, but you have to pay for full access, in chess365 there was more games and you didn't have to pay for full access. That's the DB I always use, I didn't find one for the Parham.
Please be relevant, helpful and nice!
The bottom line here is the Parham is a perfectly valid opening, that's fine to play.
Somehow I think I am going to side with not only the better player, but the more expierienced person, the engines, GM's, and my own gut feeling, and say this opening is a POS (for those who don't know that acronym google it.)