Good defense against Italian opening or Giuoco Piano

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Avatar of sammy_boi
Conquistador wrote:
StickyAxis wrote:

I think French Defense is good. It blocks the fried liver attack

So does the Grob.

He thinks he's clever for necroing a 5 year old topic.

But anyway, 3...Bc5 and 3...Nf6 are normal. 3...Be7 is fine. 3...d6 maybe not so good.

As usual for opening topics the OP seems to be asking for some magic solution that makes chess easy. Nothing makes it easy, but that's why it's fun. Pick a defense and learn it well. 

Avatar of Yamrai
algorab wrote:

The Hungarian nullifies all white tricks

White always Bxf7 which prevents me from doing castle later on.. So annoying how can i stop this

Avatar of pfren
Yamrai έγραψε:
algorab wrote:

The Hungarian nullifies all white tricks

White always Bxf7 which prevents me from doing castle later on.. So annoying how can i stop this

 Just gobble that bishop. But don't burp loudly: it's impolite.

Avatar of krecs
pfren wrote:
Yamrai έγραψε:
algorab wrote:

The Hungarian nullifies all white tricks

White always Bxf7 which prevents me from doing castle later on.. So annoying how can i stop this

 Just gobble that bishop. But don't burp loudly: it's impolite.

You are correct, although very dangerous at lower levels.

Avatar of ZlyphrrPlayz
Conquistador wrote:
StickyAxis wrote:

I think French Defense is good. It blocks the fried liver attack

So does the Grob.

Grob is bad! Unless the people your versing doesn't know the traps.

Avatar of Conquistador
ZlyphrrPlayz wrote:
Conquistador wrote:
StickyAxis wrote:

I think French Defense is good. It blocks the fried liver attack

So does the Grob.

Grob is bad! Unless the people your versing doesn't know the traps.

While that is a correct statement, my point was one more of sarcasm considering the irrelevancy of the French Defense in a discussion of dealing with a knight sack line in the Two Knights Defense.  That and it was a five year necrobump which doesn't help the OP.

Avatar of FaceCrusher

1...c5 /thread 

Avatar of Mikael2323

 

Avatar of kindaspongey

Has Elite_Spartan been here since 2012?

Avatar of Cookies124
MikaelOlsen2323 wrote:

 

thats what my team captain told me to do in chess against fried liver attack

Avatar of kindaspongey
Cookies124 wrote:
MikaelOlsen2323 wrote:

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxe5 Qg5 5. Nxf7 Qxg2 6. Rf1 Qxe4+ 7. Be2 Nf3#]

thats what my team captain told me to do in chess against fried liver attack

"White has a clear advantage, in space and development." - IM Jan Pinski (2005)

"4 Ng5 is a frightening move to face, which is why I recommend 3...Bc5 instead of 3...Nf6 to young players who have just started to learn chess openings. However, the Two Knights Defence is a sound opening, ...

… This is my recommended response to 4 Ng5. …" - GM John Emms (2018)

Avatar of Cookies124
kindaspongey wrote:
Cookies124 wrote:
MikaelOlsen2323 wrote:

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxe5 Qg5 5. Nxf7 Qxg2 6. Rf1 Qxe4+ 7. Be2 Nf3#]

thats what my team captain told me to do in chess against fried liver attack

"White has a clear advantage, in space and development." - IM Jan Pinski (2005)

"4 Ng5 is a frightening move to face, which is why I recommend 3...Bc5 instead of 3...Nf6 to young players who have just started to learn chess openings. However, the Two Knights Defence is a sound opening, ...

… This is my recommended response to 4 Ng5. …" - GM John Emms (2018)

But we are talking aout how to defend against italian game and it's clear we just shutdown their plan anyways.

Avatar of kindaspongey
Cookies124 wrote:
kindaspongey wrote:
Cookies124 wrote:
MikaelOlsen2323 wrote:

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxe5 Qg5 5. Nxf7 Qxg2 6. Rf1 Qxe4+ 7. Be2 Nf3#]

thats what my team captain told me to do in chess against fried liver attack

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxd4 exd4 5. c3 dxc3 6. Nxc3 c6 7. d4 Nf6 8. Qf3]

"White has a clear advantage, in space and development." - IM Jan Pinski (2005) ...

But we are talking aout how to defend against italian game and it's clear we just shutdown their plan anyways.

I am not sure that I understand you correctly, but, if your idea is to advocate 3...Nd4, it seems to me to be a good idea to note that White might play 4 Nxd4 instead of 4 Nxe5. For Black, it is not very satisfactory to "shutdown" White's plan by a method that allows White "a clear advantage, in space and development".

"... I recommend 3...Bc5 instead of 3...Nf6 to young players who have just started to learn chess openings. However, the Two Knights Defence is a sound opening, …

… This is my recommended response to 4 Ng5. …" - GM John Emms (2018)

Avatar of Cookies124
kindaspongey wrote:
Cookies124 wrote:
kindaspongey wrote:
Cookies124 wrote:
MikaelOlsen2323 wrote:

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxe5 Qg5 5. Nxf7 Qxg2 6. Rf1 Qxe4+ 7. Be2 Nf3#]

thats what my team captain told me to do in chess against fried liver attack

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxd4 exd4 5. c3 dxc3 6. Nxc3 c6 7. d4 Nf6 8. Qf3]

"White has a clear advantage, in space and development." - IM Jan Pinski (2005) ...

But we are talking aout how to defend against italian game and it's clear we just shutdown their plan anyways.

I am not sure that I understand you correctly, but, if your idea is to advocate 3...Nd4, it seems to me to be a good idea to note that White might play 4 Nxd4 instead of 4 Nxe5. For Black, it is not very satisfactory to "shutdown" White's plan by a method that allows White "a clear advantage, in space and development".

"... I recommend 3...Bc5 instead of 3...Nf6 to young players who have just started to learn chess openings. However, the Two Knights Defence is a sound opening, …

… This is my recommended response to 4 Ng5. …" - GM John Emms (2018)

ohhhhhh i see

Avatar of pfren
Cookies124 έγραψε:
MikaelOlsen2323 wrote:

 

thats what my team captain told me to do in chess against fried liver attack

 

I do not know the name of this line.

Let's call this "the Hope Chess variation".

After the simple 4.Nxd4 exd4 5.0-0, the game has transposed to a Ruy Lopez Bird variation, but with white being a whole tempo up.

So, the verdict on this line should be "rubbish".

Avatar of llamonade2
Cookies124 wrote:
MikaelOlsen2323 wrote:

thats what my team captain told me to do in chess against fried liver attack

That's not the fried liver attack, it's the Italian, and even after 3...Nf6 white can't force the fried liver attack.

 

Cookies124 wrote:

But we are talking aout how to defend against italian game and it's clear we just shutdown their plan anyways.

I guess you realized it's not the fried liver. In any case Bc4 isn't played with the "plan" of black letting them play a fried liver.

Avatar of kindaspongey
llamonade2 wrote:
Cookies124 wrote:
kindaspongey wrote:
Cookies124 wrote:
MikaelOlsen2323 wrote:

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxe5 Qg5 5. Nxf7 Qxg2 6. Rf1 Qxe4+ 7. Be2 Nf3#]

thats what my team captain told me to do in chess against fried liver attack

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxd4 exd4 5. c3 dxc3 6. Nxc3 c6 7. d4 Nf6 8. Qf3]

"White has a clear advantage, in space and development." - IM Jan Pinski (2005) ...

But we are talking aout how to defend against italian game and it's clear we just shutdown their plan anyways.

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 is] not the fried liver attack, it's the Italian, and even after 3...Nf6 white can't force the fried liver attack. ... Bc4 isn't played with the "plan" of black letting them play a fried liver.

I’m not sure that Cookies124 had it in mind to indicate that fried liver is necessarily the “plan” after 3 Bc4, but, if that was the intention, it might be somewhat understandable. If posts around here are any indication, it seems to be a widespread beginner perception that White’s main strategy is to go for 1 e4 e5 2 Nf3 Nc6 3 Bc4 Nf6 4 Ng5 d5 5 exd5 Nxd5 6 Nxf7+ etc. Perhaps, in many settings, team captains promote that sort of thinking in order to please a school administrator with a bunch of team victories against other beginners. Probably, it is a good idea to encourage players to have an improved awareness of the variety of possible sensible ways to play.

Avatar of Cookies124
kindaspongey wrote:
llamonade2 wrote:
Cookies124 wrote:
kindaspongey wrote:
Cookies124 wrote:
MikaelOlsen2323 wrote:

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxe5 Qg5 5. Nxf7 Qxg2 6. Rf1 Qxe4+ 7. Be2 Nf3#]

thats what my team captain told me to do in chess against fried liver attack

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxd4 exd4 5. c3 dxc3 6. Nxc3 c6 7. d4 Nf6 8. Qf3]

"White has a clear advantage, in space and development." - IM Jan Pinski (2005) ...

But we are talking aout how to defend against italian game and it's clear we just shutdown their plan anyways.

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 is] not the fried liver attack, it's the Italian, and even after 3...Nf6 white can't force the fried liver attack. ... Bc4 isn't played with the "plan" of black letting them play a fried liver.

I’m not sure that Cookies124 had it in mind to indicate that fried liver is necessarily the “plan” after 3 Bc4, but, if that was the intention, it might be somewhat understandable. If posts around here are any indication, it seems to be a widespread beginner perception that White’s main strategy is to go for 1 e4 e5 2 Nf3 Nc6 3 Bc4 Nf6 4 Ng5 d5 5 exd5 Nxd5 6 Nxf7+ etc. Perhaps, in many settings, team captains promote that sort of thinking in order to please a school administrator with a bunch of team victories against other beginners. Probably, it is a good idea to encourage players to have an improved awareness of the variety of possible sensible ways to play.

usually for beginners (im for sure a bot)   for white i usually see them do e4, e5, qh5, g6, qxe5, be7, qxh8

Avatar of llamonade2

Hey, you almost gave a string of legal moves, good job.

Avatar of Cookies124
kindaspongey wrote:
llamonade2 wrote:
Cookies124 wrote:
kindaspongey wrote:
Cookies124 wrote:
MikaelOlsen2323 wrote:

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxe5 Qg5 5. Nxf7 Qxg2 6. Rf1 Qxe4+ 7. Be2 Nf3#]

thats what my team captain told me to do in chess against fried liver attack

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Nd4 4. Nxd4 exd4 5. c3 dxc3 6. Nxc3 c6 7. d4 Nf6 8. Qf3]

"White has a clear advantage, in space and development." - IM Jan Pinski (2005) ...

But we are talking aout how to defend against italian game and it's clear we just shutdown their plan anyways.

[1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 is] not the fried liver attack, it's the Italian, and even after 3...Nf6 white can't force the fried liver attack. ... Bc4 isn't played with the "plan" of black letting them play a fried liver.

I’m not sure that Cookies124 had it in mind to indicate that fried liver is necessarily the “plan” after 3 Bc4, but, if that was the intention, it might be somewhat understandable. If posts around here are any indication, it seems to be a widespread beginner perception that White’s main strategy is to go for 1 e4 e5 2 Nf3 Nc6 3 Bc4 Nf6 4 Ng5 d5 5 exd5 Nxd5 6 Nxf7+ etc. Perhaps, in many settings, team captains promote that sort of thinking in order to please a school administrator with a bunch of team victories against other beginners. Probably, it is a good idea to encourage players to have an improved awareness of the variety of possible sensible ways to play.

im also srry for doing the other post because (yea but we just shut blah blah blah) i said that cuz me no like be wrong.