Sicilian Defense: Closed Variation

Lol, najdorf, you don't have any rating above 1800 on this site (though the only thing you've really played in correspondence) and you want to talk about studying openings for hours. You know why the greats studied openings for hours? Because they had tremendous understanding of all the more important facets of the game first. They know the majority of the technical endings and how to win/draw them. They certainly were well beyond dropping pieces to simple tactics (most of the time). At our level you just need to achieve a playable position you understand. Studying theory 30 moves deep is completely pointless. And I won't need to know all your mainline najdorf theory as a foundation for anything. Why? Because I'm just going to play the closed sicilian and while you just flounder about and likely parrot your typical najdorf moves because the mainline is all you know I'll proceed to outplay you over the board.

Yeah there are about 3 different kingside fianchetto variations black can do against the Closed Sicilian.

Yeah the can play ne7 or nf6, but from what I've seen in certain variations nf6 can allow white to gain time on their g4 - g5 plan.

The Nf6 line went out of fashion after Black took some tremendous beatings with it in the 1960s and 1970s (Spassky was often White). I believe Kasparov revived Nf6 in the 1990s, but for mere mortals, I think the position is easier to play if you prevent White from playing f5, by using the e6/Nge7 line. As you also point out, Nf6 encourages White to play g4-g5, which White can then follow up with Nd5, among other things.

Kenneth_Thomas wrote:

Taulmaril wrote:

Black has played the kingside fianchetto most times against me though not usually with nf6.

The Nf6 line went out of fashion after Black took some tremendous beatings with it in the 1960s and 1970s (Spassky was often White). I believe Kasparov revived Nf6 in the 1990s, but for mere mortals, I think the position is easier to play if you prevent White from playing f5, by using the e6/Nge7 line. As you also point out, Nf6 encourages White to play g4-g5, which White can then follow up with Nd5, among other things.

Indeed. Though it may depend on the variation but yes white plays for g4 g5 and nf6 gives him a hook to gain a tempo.

Huh? Why are ratings relevant in this discussion? 

I'm a veteran of 30+ yrs. Anything you have to say, I've heard and acknowledge as simply opinion. I'm not claiming anything but in my own experience. 

Soo yeah, not needing to study mainline French Tarrasch, Staunton Gambit Dutch Defense, KGD & KGA, QGA, QGD Tarrasch, QGD Exchange Variation,  Sicilian Najdorf PPV and even the Closed Variation is your opinion? Cool.

I never ever said you should study openings for hours. I just said mainlines are always the best to study over deviations. Are we crystal?

Heh. Finally. Guess an elitist like you can play anything, have an absolute opinion on anything as long as your audience is lower rated than you. Geez get an FM, NM, IM title already boss.

Thanks jengaias. Definitely the most aesthetically pleasing move I have ever played in a tournament game, and it being against my now highest rated victory is that much better. Do you have any experience with this variation? Any pointers on alternatives? 

Nice game, Taulmaril. I'm glad to see you're getting some experience with Spassky's variation.

One other pointer that occurred to me. If Black plays Bb7/a6 in the Closed Sicilian or White plays Bb2/a3 in the Closed English, it makes it easier for White to get in f5 or Black to play f4, respectively.

Thanks a lot pfren. Yes that's exactly why I play the closed Sicilian. I want an equal position where the game is decided over the board, not by who knows move 27 of dragon theory.

Well Kenneth the thing was I already could have played f5 when I played that silly move Nd2. I guess when black opts for the Nf6 setup instead of the e6/nge7 setup it makes that break easier for white. I still have to figure out the ins and outs of when black plays an early e5 or f5, as well as the e6 Nge7 setup.

I have discovered that the French Defense is my kind of opening now. lol. Sicilian is fine though too if you're playing as black. :)

Taulmaril, exactly right. The Nf6 setup makes f5 a lot easier for White but, as I said before, it's not the end of the world for Black. Black can seek counterplay on the dark squares. One thing Black has to avoid is playing e5 after he's played Nf6, because that would allow g5/f6/Nd5. I think the e6/f5 setup is one of the most fascinating; be sure to look at John Watson's treatment of the analogous reversed position in Mastering the Chess Openings, Volume 3. The reversed Botvinnik (e5/Nge7) is a very ambitious plan for Black and is also very interesting.

I'll be looking forward to those games. Congratulations on taking down a Master!

3. Bb5+ is actually a good, solid line that I use when I don't want to go into the Najdorf/Dragon/Scheveningen, or I think that my opponent can't play the blocked-center positions that result. My results with it have been fantastic.

 As always comments and recommendations on improvements are welcome and appreciated.

Correction on 1 note, on move 10 I cannot play Bh6 as that just loses a pawn.

Definitely a solid chess thread!

Thanks guys.