Two Knights Defense Question

Arguably, 6...c6 is better; however, I often struggle to convert the positional advantage into anything concrete. Is it safer to just play 6...Bd7 so as to avoid losing material? Will I still lose material somehow, or will the game still be okay?

Thanks in advance! =)

(I play the Polerio Defense for Black a lot with 6...c6)

Objectively, I think 6...Bd7 could be okay for Black; especially as a surprise weapon to avoid theory. However, positionally speaking: I don't think it really "solves" anything that 6...c6 doesn't. 

The problem is that Black has sacrificed a pawn already (and in some mainlines even a second pawn later) and relies on the initiative and piece development to get compensation. If you play 6...Bd7 as a repertoire choice, then you will probably find out that Black struggles to get something long lasting from this opening because you are trading Bishops. With this "simple exchange" you are taking pieces off of the chess board, but this arguably helps White more here! The reason is because Black has sacrificed material already. You have less attacking potential with less pieces on the board and you also usually do not want to be trading down into an endgame when you are already down in material.

You can experiment with this opening idea (6...Bd7), but I don't think it is in the spirit of this opening. You can perhaps switch opening choices or decide to go full force into the sharp lines after 6...c6, but this latter option is not for the faint of heart and you may end up sacrificing even more material a few moves later. 

U give wrong ideas and assesments.

6...Bd7 is perfectly playable, not sure it is worse than c6.

"With this "simple exchange" you are taking pieces off of the chess board, but this arguably helps White more here". Not at all! Bxd7 for white is a mistake, giving black an easy way to get back his pawn and developing :

The only testing move is 7.Qe2 where black has choice between Bd6 (protects d6 but blocks d file) and Be7 (which leads to very complicated struggle).

c6 is just the trendy move since ages but i can assure u that Bd7 is quite fine.

Perhaps 6...Bd7 is slightly better than I gave credit (although I did say it was playable, just perhaps not "in the spirit of this opening" - in fact I even said the op should "experiment with this opening idea.").

However, I still believe that 6...c6 is more testing - there is a reason it is "trendy." In addition, I still stand by my "ideas and assessments" [that you believed were "wrong"] IM @poucin. I've always respected your insights in the chess.com forums (even though many members may not always have). One reason is because you often give convincing lines and analysis with your ideas and plans. However, I would like to see more of that here if you are an advocate of the op playing 6...Bd7 as a repertoire choice. You can never tell with a chess game, but I don't think an opponent who follows Italian Game Opening theory this far would fall for the simple fork via 10. Rxe5?? under time controls that aren't really short.

Granted, you were probably just illustrating one way White could go wrong. I would love to see more analysis on the Qe2 ideas though (move 7 or move 8). They look creative and less common - at the very least, I am more unfamiliar with this compared to the ...c6 lines in the Polerio Defense. 

I am also interested in the merits of White giving back the pawn with 9. d4 too. With this, White catches up in development and the Black Knight on a5 is kind of lonely on the rim.

I am curious to learn more if you have more to show IM @poucin. I don't think my analysis was "wrong" though; from my experience with Black in these ...c6 lines: Black strives for maintaining the initiative and the attack - if they lose it, then the extra material White holds will slowly kill Black in the endgame. Trading material (like the Bishops on d7) minimizes attacking prospects, so it feels inconsistent with the opening plans: at least the way I see it. 

If this is "wrong", then perhaps you can contribute to this forum thread I created a few months ago. This thread (to a game I played) is a big part of "where I am coming from" with my ideas about the initiative and Black avoiding exchanges voluntarily. 

https://www.chess.com/forum/view/game-analysis/how-did-black-lose-the-initiative-what-are-some-key-factors-i-mis-evaluated-or-failed- 

In this game, I was Black and needless to say: I got crushed! I lost the initiative and didn't keep the attack like I thematically could have. I've had much greater success with Black in this opening since then, but only by keeping the attacking spirit alive and avoiding "simple exchanges" of pieces (like the Bishop exchange on d7 appears to do: recommended by the op).

If there is a way for Black to play in a less aggressive manner, then I'd like to know how and with what variations; of course, I'd probably stick to the sharp and aggressive stuff that I like anyhow

Some games with analysis (i kept some french comments by mine). Most games in blitz/bullet. Of course,  bad played by white, but when u have a bad position, u play badly...

It just show how it is easy for black when white plays Bxd7.

Yes 6...Bd7 is very playable, but probably the main reason for 6...c6 being more popular is because of 6...Bd6 7.Qe2 Be7 8.Nf3!, but not many players will know this and even if they do, I think black is only at a slight disadvantage. Besides that one line, it seems like all other lines are perfectly fine for black.

Here, Mamedyarov plays 7.Be2!?, which I was not familiar with, and takes down a very strong GM

The Bd7 line is not as good as the c6 line I thijnk cause white gets a lot of initiative with Qe2

Ok Mamed won a game which didn't prove anything since black's play can be improved.

For example, Skembris propose 10...Nb4 or 13...Bd6 with no problem for black.

Guys how about this:

I think that's good for white

When a very strong and well prepared grandmaster chooses a move, it seems extremely foolish to say it "doesn't prove anything." Of course it does. It proves that a very strong and well prepared grandmaster chose that move! 

Qe2 is the main move, the only one which can cause troubles for black.

I just answered KeSetoKaiba about what can happen on Bxd7, which is a poor choice for white (though very popular at low level since Qe2 is not natural at all).

Qe2 leads to many lines, and it would be complicated to show them all here. For example, example played by Mamedyarov is just a minor line, as Emchel's Nf3.

Moreover, on Qe2, black has choice between Bd6 and Be7 (Be7 being favoured but Bd6 is playable too and simpler).

We could add that c6 is probably better but highly complicated to handle too, especially in Qf3 and Bd3 lines.

ok thank you, I just was surprised because all the games here are Bxd7 lines

I mean practically it's probably a very decent choice because white players probably won't know the line that well and it's also objectively a decent line. But 6...c6 is theoretically the best move, the downside is more theory.

The OP said that he wanted to play 6...Bd7 because he doesn't like being down a pawn, however, after 6...Bd7, you're still going to be down a pawn and it's still kinda complicated. Not as complicated as 6...c6 though, but either way, you're probably going to have to study some theory.

i play the two knights and although i know that 6..bd7 exists i never even studied it. it's probably okay for black but to me it seems to give white an easier time. after 6..c6 for the most part white has to play defensively and consolidate and for non-gms that's hard to do.