Infinite chess openings

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HorribleTomato

True... maybe I'll design one!

vickalan
captaintugwash wrote:

 ...And I really look forward to the "Four Hawks" game where both players develop the hawks before moving anything else.

I think hawks have enough value that this might be sound play. You sacrice pawn and other piece development, but in the meantime you bring other good pieces into play.

If each player starts with four hawk-only moves, and if they move only toward the center, then there are 4 ways to place the hawks (LL LR RL or RR). The opponent can do the same, for a total of 4 x 4 = 16 variations of the "Four-hawks Opening". Hawks can go other places too, but I think these central locations are strongest.

null

HorribleTomato

To defeat hawk openings:

1. Activate the queen/rooks/chancellors early to harass the hawk

2.Obtain a large center to subdue the hawk if it wants to enter the center very early

3.While they're spending time arranging a role for their hawk, bring your hawks in

4.Pick the opponent's hawk pawns in the middle game, attempt to go into an endgame

choose between 1 and 2, do 3 and 4

hitthepin
If it were that simple...
hitthepin
Tugwash lets you pick off all his pawns, then he checkmates you.
hitthepin
The best way to beat hawk openings is to use your hawks. The only thing that stops your opponent’s hawk is your hawk.
captaintugwash

I would expect either 2 or 3 to be the way to deal with hawk openings... either develop hawks too, or use the central pawns to restrict the hawk's mobility in the centre.

 

Activating the big pieces... didn't work out for pixel. The chancellors alone are easy to deal with, and the queen was never threatening to support them.

 

And 4? That seems like a long term plan and needs to be supported with one of the other options for the short term.

HorribleTomato

yes, bringing in hawks is good, but really early is quite premature, I think. Sacrificing a pawn/your center to bring out the hawk very early isn't the best choice. One line could possibly be 1.(3,4) H(1,12) 2.(4,4) H(4,9) 3(4,5) black now will try something french style (5,6) then white will keep developing N(3,3) (3,6) H(1,-3)! The white hawk will come in and now he has cozy center and it didn't matter that the black hawk got there first. 

hitthepin
You can bring out your hawks and still keep all the pawns in your Jäger units. It only takes a bishop two moves to defend the outside rear pawn. That’s my current idea.
HorribleTomato

Jager? What's that?

hitthepin
The term, coined by @vickalan, that refers to the group of pieces behind the original starting position, consisting of a hawk and five pawns.
HorribleTomato

Why demote bishops to the lowly job of guarding rear pawns?

hitthepin
I like those pawns.
garfield92037

Awsome

HorribleTomato

They can be used as

1. queen/chancellor/rook bait

2. Time gainers

3.Endgame superiority

4. To build trump's wall (I'll explain that later)

5. Hawk Guards 

It's quite simple- the low points of the HP make them worth, in reality, much more! This is what I mean when I say more points are a curse

ALSO... DO NOT BE AFRAID TO SACRIFICE THESE IN THE MIDDLE GAME IF THE TEMPO IS WORTH IT!!! Nursing these pawns will be your death. It will make your troops passive so the enemy can full- scale let an attack rip! 9 points (Bishop pair) to guard 2 points? (4 HPs) Too much expense.

hitthepin
Maybe... we will see!
hitthepin
I feel like we’ve moved outside openings.
captaintugwash
HorribleTomato wrote:

Why demote bishops to the lowly job of guarding rear pawns?

Why assign any piece to this job?

HorribleTomato
captaintugwash wrote:
HorribleTomato wrote:

Why demote bishops to the lowly job of guarding rear pawns?

Why assign any piece to this job?

You know, maybe that's why the eagles are where they are... just sayin'.

captaintugwash

I guess my point is that it's a lowly job for such a high value piece. Rather the bishop protect them than a hawk, at least the bishop can protect them from afar.