Outrageous! You can't play multiple games anymore.

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Phylar
SecretOfMana wrote:
Phylar wrote: 
Complain all you want, but words, pretty as they may be, won't make a real difference. 

Your argument was absurd. It's not complaining, it's common sense.

This problem is hardly solveable with software without monitoring it. Assuming ragequitters have at least one brain cell, they will not keep leaving games all the time, but rather stall it with a move each xx minutes, making it hard to trace them, as some positions indeed require minutes to analyze.

That being said, a behaviour rating system depends on the honesty of players, and a lot of people tend to mark a player as toxic if they lose. Hence it won't work.

I cannot think of any reasonable solution to this problem, as it only affects a few % of all games. It is just not worth it to invest all those man-hours in it, especially for something that, most likely, doesn't even work optimally.

But, the reason why people complain is that a feature what was free is a paid service now. It is like removing tactics trainer for free members -> people will complain. If tactics trainer was never free, people wouldn't complain.

Now onto my favorite part:

"erik (staff)

Unfortunately multi-games was being abused badly as players would simply leave a game in progress and start a new one just to irritate their opponent. There isn't much we can do to prevent it, though paying members are subject to having their accounts closed for abusing this. But for free members, the bad ones just don't care, and it is one of our top complaints.

Every day lots of "Hey, I was winning a game and my opponent just stopped moving with 10 minutes left to go in the game. So then I follow him and find out he just started a new game!!!" 

I'm sorry that the actions of a bunch of bad-behavors ruins it for others."

"IM ACEChess (staff)

Hey Sir_Connery,

You make a good point. We also like this idea of a "self-moderating" behavior system by the members, though it's also not going to be easily implemented. What if members begin "thumbs downing" other members for kicks? There will need to be an automatic system of checks and balances... 

The only thing I'd ask you to consider while we try to figure this out (and we will try to find the best solution) is that it's not bad behavior "by a few" that the "majority" is now getting punished for. Unfortunately, it's proven to be bad behavior by a large majority of members, and the complaints are many and often.

It's not a "premium vs basic" member issue! We love all our members Wink -- BUT you have to appreciate our point: If you now encounter a premium member who is abusing in this way, he can be reported, and when he gets caught and eventually banned for this abuse, he is losing money.

It *does* make a difference. Starting a new game, because others are doing the same to you is kind of "two wrongs don't make a right". We may find a better way to moderate this and allow basic members this feature back, but it's going to take some time, and the level of abuse that was happening was simply too much to ignore. Cry

Thanks for your feedback here. We don't want you to go anywhere..."

 

I think the above answers in my defense.

TheLastSupper

It does not defend that your 2nd argument was absurd:

  • If you are playing for fun then there is little reason to complain. Just abort/forfeit the game. Start another. The fun continues.

 

And honestly, I do not care that much. I just find it funny that the "short-term" solution (which I highly highly doubt it will be short-term), enhances the frustration, as free member, you get when someone stalls intentionally. Yes the other can't start a new game either, but hey, at least the chess fanatic can't either :D And then he feels like a badass, a real hooligan: "Look at me, stalling games, #SWAG"

Phylar
SecretOfMana wrote:

It does not defend that your 2nd argument was absurd:

If you are playing for fun then there is little reason to complain. Just abort/forfeit the game. Start another. The fun continues.

 

And honestly, I do not care that much. I just find it funny that the "short-term" solution (which I highly highly doubt it will be short-term), enhances the frustration, as free member, you get when someone stalls intentionally. Yes the other can't start a new game either, but hey, at least the chess fanatic can't either :D And then he feels like a badass, a real hooligan: "Look at me, stalling games, #SWAG"

I don't need to defend my second argument because, in truth, it defends itself. You play for fun? You won't be bothered by this issue. Pretty simple.

Anyway, if you were running a business would you pull charity out of your rear day after day or would you be wanting and willing to make a buck, make some money? I suspect this will be fairly short-term. As for the complaining, ha, that'll never stop.

Sir_Connery

Honestly, for the argument that you should just abort if you see someone possibly not responding to the game? So the solution is now to actually give the ragequitters free wins? And this helps the situation how? Also, it takes a while to know if someone has actually left, I play 30 min games and it's not unusual to take 5 mins for a crucial turn.

I guess I'll just have to start playing online chess here or something.

EricFleet
josehern16 wrote:

Since when do you have to be a "Premium" member to be able to play multiple games? This is outrageous chess.com! I'm done with you. 

Apparently not

http://www.chess.com/livechess/game?id=538950120

adamstask

How come non-paying members can't have their usage reported and curtailed if they abuse the system? I still don't understand why premium members (who according to Phylar don't need simultaneous games because they're 'serious'... lol) get simultaneous play, ostensibly because if they abuse it they can get reported and penalized, while non-paying members cannot be reported so they shouldn't be allowed simultaneous play...Why can't non-paying abusers be reported and penalized? This is a question for staff. Staff will respond to this thread with respect and seriousness because they can be penalized for doing otherwise, while even premium members can apparently engage in ad hominem attacks and beside-the-point self-congratulations. 

Phylar
radioarno wrote:

How come non-paying members can't have their usage reported and curtailed if they abuse the system? I still don't understand why premium members (who according to Phylar don't need simultaneous games because they're 'serious'... lol) get simultaneous play, ostensibly because if they abuse it they can get reported and penalized, while non-paying members cannot be reported so they shouldn't be allowed simultaneous play...Why can't non-paying abusers be reported and penalized? This is a question for staff. Staff will respond to this thread with respect and seriousness because they can be penalized for doing otherwise, while even premium members can apparently engage in ad hominem attacks and beside-the-point self-congratulations. 

Stop making foolish assumptions regarding the comments I made. Not once have I mentioned premium membership, get your facts straight before you show yourself off as a fool. Us paying members can, if you read what the staff member above stated THOROUGHLY, have our priviledges revoked and we WILL LOSE MONEY. In short, if we do enough, they take our money AND we become restricted or can lose our account.

I made the comments I made because you are unwilling to admit that you are incorrect in the statements you have made and are continuing a discussion that should be done. This is the absolute last post I am making regarding this issue as I have made plenty of good points and only the people, yourself being specifically among them, who refuse to listen to reason are continuing. I acknowledge your argument, I acknowledge your logic, but you sir have no idea what you are talking about.

Good day and may you win your next game, time loss or not.

EDIT: Oh and to stop your committed attack against any of the staff. In other threads I openly stated that any or all of my comments can and should be deleted if deemed to violate any of the codes and rules that govern this site are broken and that they are free, on my posts, to make personal decisions regarding them. They have not yet done this so I assume that, while I have been harsh on occasion, I am well within my rights as I have not made truly specific and harsh attacks against any one member. Anyway, cheers, have a wonderful life. We'll chat again on the board should that ever come to pass.

DrFrank124c
Phylar wrote:
radioarno wrote:

How come non-paying members can't have their usage reported and curtailed if they abuse the system? I still don't understand why premium members (who according to Phylar don't need simultaneous games because they're 'serious'... lol) get simultaneous play, ostensibly because if they abuse it they can get reported and penalized, while non-paying members cannot be reported so they shouldn't be allowed simultaneous play...Why can't non-paying abusers be reported and penalized? This is a question for staff. Staff will respond to this thread with respect and seriousness because they can be penalized for doing otherwise, while even premium members can apparently engage in ad hominem attacks and beside-the-point self-congratulations. 

Stop making foolish assumptions regarding the comments I made. Not once have I mentioned premium membership, get your facts straight before you show yourself off as a fool. Us paying members can, if you read what the staff member above stated THOROUGHLY, have our priviledges revoked and we WILL LOSE MONEY. In short, if we do enough, they take our money AND we become restricted or can lose our account.

I made the comments I made because you are unwilling to admit that you are incorrect in the statements you have made and are continuing a discussion that should be done. This is the absolute last post I am making regarding this issue as I have made plenty of good points and only the people, yourself being specifically among them, who refuse to listen to reason are continuing. I acknowledge your argument, I acknowledge your logic, but you sir have no idea what you are talking about.

Good day and may you win your next game, time loss or not.

EDIT: Oh and to stop your committed attack against any of the staff. In other threads I openly stated that any or all of my comments can and should be deleted if deemed to violate any of the codes and rules that govern this site are broken and that they are free, on my posts, to make personal decisions regarding them. They have not yet done this so I assume that, while I have been harsh on occasion, I am well within my rights as I have not made truly specific and harsh attacks against any one member. Anyway, cheers, have a wonderful life. We'll chat again on the board should that ever come to pass.

what does ad homininem mean?

adamstask

Phylar writes <EDIT: Oh and to stop your committed attack against any of the staff.>

lol, there was no attack on staff. There was a request that staff respond to my question, because some paying members can't behave themselves ;->  

I think that anyone who abuses the system by abandoning live games without resigning should receive sanctions on their usage, premium or not. and that if there is a capacity to play live simuls it should be available to all, since, as I have explained, it is useful for when an opponent abandons a game with a long time control. I only realized simul was no longer available to me when this happened recently, and I couldn't resume play with a new game for twenty minutes. When playing in the public library, for example, on computers where you have timed usage, not being able to resume play quickly is a major bummer, especially when you made the trip to the public library just to play chess on chess.com

 



adamstask

Sir_Connery, yes, precisely. Giving ragequitters free wins will certainly not reduce the abuse of the system; it will reward it. I agree. :)

spiderman786

In addition to this I found that getting an actual game on live chess is becoming increasingly difficult. Any ideas on how this may be resolved.

b0untyy

why not add a "ping" feature: if its your opponents move, you can ping him once and he has to confirm within a certain amount of time. if hes not responding, stop the game and count it as a win

username20142014

I think it's ok

MonkeyH

I am saddened that this short term solution now somehow is permanent for free members.