Response from Caught Cheater - Worth Reading

I reckon it was pretty unusual for Eric to receive such a reply from a caught cheater.  Too bad it was Kepler and not the obvious, arrogant fraud in our midst.

So did he only cheat in one game, or was it dozens? Hundreds even? This was not, I imagine, a one time deal. If your wife cheats on you once, and apologizes voluntarily, do you forgive her? Maybe. What about if she cheats on you consistently for a year, and only apologizes once you catch her? No way.

And do we all slip up? Sure. We all lie. I'm sure most of us cheated on a test when we were kids. And when we were caught, we suffered the consequences.

One of the early lessons of childhood is "sorry doesn't cut it."

i'm not calling him the patron saint at all :) i was just comparing him to others who add lies on top of lies and deny it.

again, this was supposed to do 2 things:

- warn others who might think about cheating "just once" about what can happen if you let yourself slip once (lose your account, lose your self-respect);

- not excuse bad behavior, but show an example of someone with a contrite heart (which is in contrast to the shameful politicians and Alex Rodriguez's of this world who can't own up).

he's not excused and not forgiven, and it's despicable what he did. but it's noteworthy how he handled his mistakes.

Bird, he knew the rules, he broke the rules, he should cop the consequences!  Just the ame as anything I have done in my life, I will always, ALWAYS, accept responsibility for my own actions! 

If he wants to apologise that is all well and good, but for people to promote him as something to aspire to, well I am sorry (there is an apology for you ), but I will never agree with that.

Very mature, and it also shows what it takes to be a real man.  God Bless whoever that is, and i wish them the best. 

And so when you messed up, your parents ostracized you, right?  Sorry doesn't cut it...my grandma got a thorn-switch out on me, but after my punishment, I wasn't kicked out on the streets...this doesn't match up here.  We do suffer consequences, and fine, if he never comes back, that is fine.  But I am making one point.  Every one of you who has pointed a finger at him, look at yourself.  We have all done things where we had to apologize.  

I even defended the side of a provisional comeback with random checkups on games, and I fully understand why Erik most likely wouldn't do that - he does want to keep up the appearance of an environment where cheaters are gone.  But we know that they are here, and they continue to be here, in accordance with his first statement regarding many cheaters being kicked off every day.  

One cheater out of many offers a good apology.  I forgive him, and honestly, I would give him another chance.  That is me, and you don't have to go by those rules.  

But bringing up the issue of a wife cheating, those are critical moments, and yes, you have to make a life-decision concerning whether to throw away what could be based on a terrible choice.  

In this case, I ask this - at least look at yourself, and see that you also have made errors in your lives where you had the opportunity to ask forgiveness.  Some of the greatest lessons I learned as a child was not with a belt, paddle, or a switch - it was with love.  People showing me what the right way was, with patience and care.  Not with a spanking.  

Now, I know this is different.  It appears we are dealing with a grown adult, not a child who needs discipline.  But at least, if you have hardened your heart towards him, think about yourself. 

This is why I don't think it should have been made public.  This guy has now been given more credit than the vast majority of the chess.com community that has never set a foot out of line!

I never brought up aspiring to anything.  But haven't you ever apologized for anything in life?  An apology when you have done wrong is better than no apology, agreed?  Or do you think it is better to just not apologize at all, like the apology is worthless?  That is fine - plenty of people do that.  But I believe people make poor decisions, and then some of them legitimately apologize, seeing the errors of their own ways.  Not in all instances.  

In reading this fellow's letter, I saw no guile at all.  A simple apology, and what appeared to be heart-felt.  I know what the guy did, but I don't think that continually grinding it in is going to help anything.  

Yes, maybe he won't do it again, it could very well be completely heartfelt, but why should he recieve any more credit (which he is) than all those on this site who have never put a foot wrong!?  It seems that people respect those who do wrong and apologise for it more than those that have the fortitude to follow the rules and not have to apologise.

He's probably running his same engine at red hot pawn and other sites as we speak.

His sob story gets nothing but laughter from me.

Good riddance.

Indeed.

closing an account without pardon if caught cheating is a law which has already been set beforehand by chess.com.

whether the cheater is a friend or not, it is considered as a life sentence i supposed which is for everyone's benefit.

in my own point of view, there's no problem if one will forgive a friend-turned-cheater who has apologized, however, if chess.com will pardon the cheater then it will set a bad precedence and it will open an opportunity for others to cheat all over again..

To be quite honest I've known about it for quite a while. ... We played a couple training games (where I felt I had played very well) and lost miserably... myself and a couple friends on this site did some checks and realized very quickly that he was fritz 11 :P. 

But I couldn't bring myself to report him.  It was obvious he was breaking the rules but he wasn't like the average idiot engine user.  He loved chess, and I couldn't be the one that took it away from him.  I won't be the one to propose we reinstate his account, cheating is a very serious problem and it's not fair to anyone to let him back.  Chess isn't a popularity contest (thank god).

Nevertheless I'll miss him here.  Hopefully we're able to stay in contact somehow.  I'm sure he's learned his lesson and now maybe I'll be able to win the occasional Ruy Exchange . 

You'll be missed Liz.

-matt

PS- if you read this, I think you know my email... feel free to stay in contact.

Honestly, Suggo, this is not about giving the fellow more credit.

I believe it is laudable these days to play an honest game of chess, regardless of your rating level.  I am only 1800, and one day I would love to be 2000+, and with hard work, I believe I will get there.  When I first came here, I think I was playing around 1400 or so...so there is some improvement.  For everyone who has played honest chess, I truly commend that - in the day of computers and databases, many resort to others trains of thoughts instead of their own.  

But we aren't really giving a lot of credit to one fellow - sure, we are praising what he did - an apology for cheating.  But I am not comparing it with someone who has never cheated at chess.com.  There is obviously a difference.  You see that in forum posts, and in games, and in all sorts of other things.  It is praise that is unheard, but is there.  You know who is memorable on this site - you don't have to say much about it...there are people who give a lot to the community, and their unsung praises are felt on this site.

But in comparing this cheating situation with others, what he did was definitely laudable, IN COMPARISON.  And it isn't like the guy simply racked up a bunch of wins.  I infer that he also contributed to the thought and growth of this site, to help it be #1.  It isn't the site - it's the people on the site, that make it so great.  People from all over the world.

So in this instance, don't think it is about praising him - it is about an issue at hand - should someone who cheated and apologized be forgiven?  I vote yes.  You may vote no.  And even if he is never on here again, I do forgive him.  And if he came back, I would probably want to play a game against him.  Scoff if you want...I value the person more than the mistake.

A mistake is something like bumping the sugarbowl off the table, you had no intention of doing it, maybe you were careless or stupid, but it's still an accident.

Sitting down, and making a conscious decision is not a mistake. Its a deliberate act.

I live in South Africa, where people daily appologise for "mistakes", because they have learnt know that feigning remorse is a good way to get sympathy, it makes people feel good to "forgive".

It was a "mistake" for Hansie Cronje, our cricket captain to accept bribes from bookies for throwing games. In the competition a few years ago where nations had to pick their greatest people, he came in 11th, just because he cried in public. Go figure......

An apology by an engine user in online chess is not original, nor praiseworthy. Maybe erik and crew receive few if any, however there is at least one website dedicated to cheating at online chess and what to say when caught.

This guys email will make their next cover story.

 There goes someone who truly isnt afraid to accept the consequences for their actions. Why cant all of us be like that?

Okay, if you want to continue to say he is unforgiveable, that is your choice...I won't say it myself.  I have already forgiven him, and that is me.  You don't have to adopt my outlook on the situation. 

Chess-kebabs, if you will, let this fellow know that at least one other person on here who doesn't really know him has forgiven him, and will not ostracize him from the chess community IN SPITE of his mistake.  It was a conscientious choice, but still - a mistake.  In the long run, he lost...  :-(  And now he is out of what may be the best chess site out there.  Come on guys - this site is a lot of fun.  He will learn his lesson.  Maybe one day you'll forgive him and move on.

A lot.

According to his first statement, he does not receive many apologies.  And even at that, this person did more than the average player - he must have contributed to the site in other ways.