Can This Really Be a Draw?

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Avatar of RoaringPawn

Things got back to normal recently after my half-a-century-waited-for "historic" win. Lost another game to my nemesis @nnnvlj, as usualhappy.png

What's most important with the game is that we reached an interesting study-like position after Black's move 36.

@RoaringPawn vs @nnnvlj

White to move

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Three pawns for a bishop. The thing is White is losing the g-pawn and then another (either the a-, or c-pawn). That way White ends up with one pawn against Bishop in this 4-knight endgame.

What is most amazing is that it seems that White can hold in this position even after losing two pawns.

So we got 1 Pawn vs 1 Bishop, plus 2N + 2P vs 2N + 2P endgame with White to move and draw. Still to be analyzed and confirmed it is really a draw.

Your thoughts?

 

 

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Avatar of damirb

mislim da to nije gubitak za belog zbog poteza c5 i Se8,ne analiziram redosled i sta nastaje za 10-15 poteza nego samo na osnovu opstih pravila,trebalo bi dublje analizirati ali je interesantno pa cu se posle detaljnije zabaviti pozicijom

Avatar of RoaringPawn
damirb wrote:

mislim da to nije gubitak za belog zbog poteza c5 i Se8,ne analiziram redosled i sta nastaje za 10-15 poteza nego samo na osnovu opstih pravila,trebalo bi dublje analizirati ali je interesantno pa cu se posle detaljnije zabaviti pozicijom

 

Hi Damir, good to hear from you! Yes, c4-c5! seems the right move. Actually I played it three moves later, but then it was too late!

 

You're right, position needs to be studied more thoroughly.

On general principles,

  1. c4-c5 creates two connected passed pawns. 
  2. The black b6-pawn will be a bit weaker defensively and less secure on c5 and will probably be made immobile and attacked by White's monarch in the future. 
  3. b6xc5 also blocks the c5 square to Black's minors, which reduces the bishop's scope and removes possibility for black Knights to use c5 as a springboard into White's camp.
  4. The blocked c5 also rules out possibility that black Knights can challenge the white Ne4 (with Nc5) which consequently makes Ne4 more stable there with its important roles of attacking Pc4, blocking Pe5 and protecting Pf2.
  5. .......

Damire, sve najbolje i jos jednom hvala na komentaru!

Avatar of EnergeticHay

Not sure, that's very complex.

Avatar of RoaringPawn
EnergeticHay wrote:

Not sure, that's very complex.

Yes, needs a thorough analysis.

Jason, thanks for visiting!

Avatar of inpetto

I like it wink.png

Avatar of Arisktotle

I wouldn't call this a "study-like position". I do not know what that is as most endgame studies look like endgame positions. The common expression "study-like solution" applies to what happens nextwink.png

Avatar of EnergeticHay
RoaringPawn wrote:
EnergeticHay wrote:

Not sure, that's very complex.

Yes, needs a thorough analysis.

Jason, thanks for visiting!

sure lol, I've been trying to figure this one out but it's not happening tongue.png

Avatar of drmrboss

No draw, white is losing. Black is a piece up and two healthy pawns remaining and it is quite impossible for white to exchange all black pawns.

For precise analysis, you better analyse with Stockfish, 1 billion nodes on 6 men endgame TB.

Avatar of Guest1387242414
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