Can someone please guide why c5 for black was a bad move here?

Hello friends,

I played with a player ranked about 450 points to be and was out played. I managed to give a fight but was trailing all along.

The player used the English opening and on third move I (black) played c5. Aim was to control centre dissuade white from playing d4.

So I thought it was a good move but on doing analysis with computer it calls it an inaccuracy. Can anyone share why it is an inaccuracy ie why is it a bad move?

Thanks!

PS : here is link to the game

Pay no attention to opening analysis from such things. 

The point of c5 is to answer d4 with cd. My first impression is that that would help white though, because it opens up the dark squared bishop.

By playing b6 and Bb7 you give white the centre. 

This early on development is key, you need to get your kingside pieces into play.

C5 is not a developing move.

To further explain notmtwain's comment, computer analysis just isn't as good in the opening phase.  There's often too much to calculate with very little difference between many positions.  This is why computers still use an opening book when you play against them.

For the opening phase, it is much better to look at an opening database, such as the Explorer on this site.  There are 21 games after 3.e3.  3. ... c5 has the 2nd most number of games, only 1 game less than 3. ... e6.  The top move has a higher win percentage for black, but the move you played has a much larger draw percentage as well as a significantly lower loss percentage for black.

Given that, yeah, you can say c5 was an "inaccuracy" since it is far more drawish than e6.  But again, this is the opening phase and we're not experts, so the difference between them doesn't really mean as much.

c5 is perfectly fine.

Don't always listen to computers.

There's nothing bad in it. I do feel that it has nothing to do. Engines are too much for humans to handle. Better not pay attention to it.

I think ....c5 is not the best, but ok to play. slight difference was ....e6. Idea is that Black is nott showing what he'll do in the center.

Ellen_Hall is right:

"Don't always listen to computers."

Well, it is a bad move. White can play d2-d4-d5 and support the d5-pawn with e3-e4, getting a nice space advantage for free. On the loss of tempo in e2-e3-e4, it's more than compensated because in the resulting pawn structure ...b7-b6 and ...Bc8-b7 are a waste of tempos for Black.

You may have seen games where Black plays ...c7-c5, but you failed to notice that Black previously played to control e4 (thus not allowing e3-e4 or making it risky) and was ready for ...d7-d5 (thus not giving White the time for d4-d5).

About the engine's "opinion" at that early stage of the game, it's often wrong when just a few seconds to analyze and no openings book. On people's opinions that unless there's a line proving that Black loses it is playable... well... should they be right then positional play is wrong.

The chess.com analysis board is inconsistent at best.

For openings most moves should be alright. Is it a great move? Probably not, but there is no obvious error to it.

I did not get how c5 can lead to an isolated pawn. Some queries wrt this:

1) Isolated pawn for me (black) or the opponent?

2) After c5 d4 cxd4 exd4 (ie 3. .. c5 4. d4 cxd4 5. exd4) where is there an isolated pawn? is white's d4 isolated? But doesn't it have pawn on c4 for company?

One query - on doing computer analysis the computer shows numbers for each move eg +0.24 etc.. Do you pay attention to those while checking the game or just ignore them?

And about any more help - yes, if you can check the entire game and share main improvement point for me then that would be super helpful (I am being greedy!)

I did not get it - dark squared bishop of black or white? And how - can you pl share more details.

Very good and educative points. And you took lot of efforts by checking old games. Thanks!

It's not a great move, but neither is it so bad that white has something to be excited about. I'd call it one of those 2nd rate, but up to personal taste, moves.

True -  with f5 i gave an opening to white's knight to come to g6 square.