Rook Endgame - Only one move is winning

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RedMountainFox

Ah I see. The point of the positions I gave is that you have to understand opposition as well as having the understanding of how to promote the pawn without drawing. Once you understand those positions, you understand that it is important to not push your pawn too early, the importance of having the king to assist promotion, the importance of not allowing the enemy king in front of your pawn or enter your opposition, and the enemies best chances/ideas for getting a draw out of a completely losing position. Here is an additional one to supplement the other ones.

This is a known draw position if our king is behind the pawn and the enemy king is in front of the pawn, regardless of transposition to any rank, and regardless if it is the a or h file (I mention those files because there are exceptions in certain king and pawn endgames), and regardless of who moves first.

It might seem like those positions I gave are unrelated, but once you understand the basics of those above endgames, you can now consider what white would want if in your given position it were not black’s turn. Analyze their threats/ideas. I would find that white would play Kd1 to attempt to get in front of the pawn as that is their best chances at a draw (moving the king away provides no fight and no chances and is not logical). Engine provides Rf8 - If you respond to Rf8# with Ke3, Re8 and you can not push your pawn because the king is in the way and despite having checks against white’s king, you find that there is no progress to be made. If after Rf8# you move your king away, black will repeatedly threaten to capture your pawn via Re8 and force your king to keep contact (you can also defend with rook but white’s king is too close and there is no win there but requires rook endgame knowledge). As a generality rook endgames are often very drawish.

SO now you understand white’s plan. How do we prevent it and implement our plan? Do we have a plan? Yes we have a plan because we know we need the assistance of our king to promote so we play Kf3 and we can deduce not Ke3 because that gets in the way of the idea of promoting. We are also not afraid of Ra3# after Kf3 because we know that we can definitely promote because we have reached the 6th rank and our king is there to help and white's king is not in time. We are not afraid of Kf3 Rf8 because we just go Ke2 and white is out of checks for now. I can't go much further as I've put a lot of effort into typing this but I hope that makes it clearer of why those are important. The ideas transcend the static positions.

https://www.chess.com/practice/drills/endgame-fundamentals

I highly recommend working on the first two drills here in the practice/drills section. That is what I worked on a couple of weeks ago and now I can get it 100% every time because I see the patterns to avoid allowing the enemy king to enter my opposition, I know when I want to enter opposition, I know not to push my pawn too far too early, I understand adjacent opposition, and I understand what to do once I reach the 3rd and 6th rank. I guarantee that these drills are extremely challenging until you master the technique. You are completely winning but if you lack precision in an endgame, you get a draw. You must play perfectly.

Kf5 is an example of what I mean by adjacent opposition btw, it's how I remember it and I'm not certain if there's a name for it but that is what allows us to advance our pawn after re-entering opposition if the enemy defends with best play.

 

Marziotta

This was indeed a huge work, thanks for the help @RedMountainFox.

Kf3 is indeed assisting the pawn without closing the way to promotion. For quite some time the king will have to hide in e1 to win the game... Could you think alone of the Lucena position starting from the basic opposition concepts?

I appreciate indeed to see the way you think. When I check for example speedruns it is difficult to follow. It is usually masters, and even the less strong do everything naturally, and you do not grasp the nuances and how difficult could it be to evaluate different candidate moves... when they already see the best move at first glance.

I will try again the drills. I do it every now and then. grin.png
I know relatively well (better than many other concepts, at least) the opposition principles, but reviewing it can only help.

Marziotta

Thanks to the drills I just have seen the Bahr's rule, that I completely forgot about!
I found a nice and clear video about it and... wanted to share. I think there is quite some material to study and review in this thread!

TwoMove

50kg said all you need to know in the second post. Ke3 isn't winning because Ra3ch. King safety is not relevant in this endgame. In rook endgames, it nearly always a good idea for the weaker side to avoid exchanging rooks.

RedMountainFox

Just watched that video, Bahr's rule is too many conditions for me to find useful. It’s just not a good way for my style of learning. You can’t just throw three rules for me in 10 seconds and expect me to integrate that into my knowledge base and simply say ok as if I’m a computer and my software updates. Could I memorize the conditions? Sure. But that takes repeated effort when I would just rather calculate it for the time being because I don’t find it to be that bad of a task. Time is an issue? Sure that’s when it becomes useful. If not, seems easier to just apply the rule of the square, knowing outer pawns are more drawish, calculate the pawn race/distracting the king, not allowing enemy king into a corner, shouldering, etc. Seems pointless to memorize a rule if we don't understand the ideas behind it. There are so many possible king and pawn + x endgames it’s like why are we starting a foundation on this one specific position? There are way more useful ones to learn first which improve your intuitional ability as well as the concrete calculation ability to know whether a position is drawn or winning AND are way more practical. Like when have you ever had this Barh's position on the board? To me, Bahr’s rule feels like a senior class when you’re a freshman. There’s just other foundations that should be done first. Just my two cents since endgames have been a recent addition to my game with my coach 3 hours a week and 10 hours on my own for the past 6 weeks. 

 

Marziotta

@TwoMove, right, he said everything but I needed to rephrase everything and metabolize it, so I followed here my path to get it. Maybe it will help somebody, or maybe it will help only me next time I will have doubt in a rook endgame, and I will remember that I wrote in the forum about it!

@RedMountainFox, to be honest I am so bad at calculating in endgames than having some easy rule to follow in some special case seems a big help to me. Not to mention, this was one of the drills you linked to me. grin.png For me time is always an issue, I very often run out of time in 60 minute games.
But you stressed indeed an important point, that I already mentioned around here.
Classes, drills, and so on and so forth, very often focus on material that is too difficult. Maybe what we beginners should focus on is really little things and understand a few basic concepts, yet... I am decent at theory and then play terribly.

There are for sure some bad habits of mine that I should take out of the equation to improve.

amchess16
Marziotta wrote:

@amchess16, funny enough, Philidor and Lucena position classes are a breeze compared to the triangulation concept.

I agree. I had to to take the triangulation lesson 2x.

TheGuyThatIsNew
50kg wrote:

The main goal for black is to prevent the Philidor position when the white king is in front of the black pawn which is a well known draw. As an 1100 rapid you most likely don't know what it is and why it's a draw thus I'd offer you to learn it. Understanding that white want to play Kd1->Ke1 if we don't stop, we should do something about it. Now let's have a look at our options.

1. If Ke3 when white has Ra3+ and we have to go back or allow a perpetual checks from the side.

2. If pawn to e3 then Kd1 and we can't stop Ke1 with a draw.

3. If Rh1+ then white king is getting to e1 via d2.

4. If nothing move the Kd1-->Ke1.

But we have Kf3 which prevents white's blockade.

 

makes sense, my thought process was, "How to stop repeated checks" which led me to Kf3 where by I can just block his check with pawn if he goes to Ra3+ or run in front of my pawn after Rf8+.

Marziotta
amchess16 wrote:
Marziotta wrote:

@amchess16, funny enough, Philidor and Lucena position classes are a breeze compared to the triangulation concept.

I agree. I had to to take the triangulation lesson 2x.

I will have to take it 300 times before grasping it. grin.png I think I have already done it 20 times.

Marziotta

@TheGuyThatIsNew, that sounds an interesting way to think. happy.png

JamesColeman

Everything has mostly been said but …Kf3 is the only move that makes any sense, it’s not even necessary to be totally confident it’s winning as every other move can be summarily dismissed:

Rook moves: let’s whites king head over the e1 square so can be rejected

Same with pushing the pawn: king can come over (also allows Rf8+ and provided white doesn’t fall asleep and check blacks king around to e2 it’s an easy draw.

Ke3 makes no sense after Ra3+ again with an easy draw.

So it only really leaves …Kf3 which (as has already been pointed out) means white can’t just play Kd1 and just waits for white to show their hand.

With whites king on e1 (instead of c1) white would be holding but check the famous game Aronian-Carlsen 2006 where a young Magnus messed up a similar situation.

Marziotta

Thank you a lot, @JamesColeman!

I found a couple of videos on the endgame you mentionedAnd also one in Russian, that seems very well explained, but my rusty A2-B1 in Russian is not helping to grasp each and every concept.

I always find funny that Russian uses in chess some German words like Schachmatt and Endspiel. grin.png

I think in the game I did Ke1 myself. Then I won because the opponent was as bad as I am in endgames and did a blunder, allowing me a mate in 1. grin.png

Marziotta

I have downloaded the Total Chess Endgames 1600-2400 from Chess King on my mobile. It has quite some good tutorials and examples, at least for opposition! I will have to check the free material first, as usual. happy.png It is curated by Panchenko, the author of one of the three books suggested in the Russian video. I have the feeling I will have to learn a bit more Russian, there is a lot of good chess material. happy.png As if I did not have already enough material around... grin.png

VenemousViper
Whisper wrote:

There are various rules of thumb in play. The first is "King Safety". Ke3 is the safest spot on the board for the Black King.

Nope, in the endgame the king must be an active piece.

Marziotta

I found a nice video on the Lucena and Philidor positions in Italian. In the end I will use this thread to study. grin.pngYesterday instead I found this one, of a CM that just started his channel and is doing it pretty well. It explains the concept that there is at the end of the previous video, the passive defense. He should explain the Philidor today!And a class about the passive defense with exercises.
https://www.chess.com/lessons/do-or-die-with-rook-endings/the-passive-defenceIt is part of a course called "Do or Die with Rook Endings". It seems nice!

Goose2999happy
R
Marziotta

@SeanLin29, R for Roooooooooooook?

TheGuyThatIsNew

@Marziotta thank you, but again I'm only 1400, so it's a simple thought process. I probably should learn more true thought processes, but this thought process worked for me in that situation.

Marziotta

@TheGuyThatIsNew, good thought process and a sane intuition can help. I feel my intuition is still dormant. grin.png And my rating is lower than yours. happy.png

Indeed, I am happy to have seen so many opinions, including yours, and ways to see that position! I will not put everything in practice straight away, but knowing a bit more of the theory and being able to put it in context will allow me, the next time, to say "here it could be crucial if I would remember passive defense, or lucena or philidor position.". And even if I will lose, I will be able to figure out why, and this is already a big lesson!

Marziotta

And, to go on about rook endgames... Why not trying some drills?

https://www.chess.com/endgames/rook/winning-rook-endings/learn

There is also another user asking some questions about it, maybe some of the people helping me can help him as well!

Here you can find the forum post!

https://www.chess.com/forum/view/endgames/chess-com-winning-rook-endings