What would your plans be for black in this position?

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Avatar of tygxc

#25
If black plays ...b6 to chase the outpost Nc5, then the knight retreats and the backward, undefended pawn c6 is weak on the open file with white's rooks. The knight outpost is powerful on c5.
f5-f4 does not make much sense as black can no longer put a knight outpost on e4.
A knight outpost plays a vital role in a succesful minority attack.
The main asset for black is his bishop's pair, so he should avoid moves like f5 that restrict the activity of his bishops. Square f5 is ideal to place a bishop as it eyes square e4 and the diagonal h7-b1.

Avatar of FangBo

Trade light squared bishop for a knight if possible (otherwise put it on g6 or h7), play ...Re8 to slow e3-e4,  play ...a5 to break up the minority attack

Avatar of Optimissed

I don't know what the Capablanca Variation is. I play Nfd2 and Qc2. The purpose of Nfd2 is threefold. It blocks the diagonal to the king, helps keep knights out of e4 and you can recapture on c4 when black plays dc, hitting black's queen. This position doesn't look as if it's come from those moves and I don't like white's position especially because white has no light squared B. All white has is c file pressure and an outpost there.

So it seems perfect for black to attack on the kingside. I'd play Bg4 right away. I like the fact that black's B can retreat to g6 hitting white's Q and controlling the important diagonal. Black has to be careful of Nb7 but I think that played well, black will be better. Like I said, white hasn't got it right.

Avatar of DefenderPug2

g6 bishop to f5. Or just bishop to g4 not sure honestly. Lots of things you can do. Ooooorrrrrr. Rook to a5.

Avatar of Optimissed
Qxe7checkmate wrote:

I'm kinda confused on why white played Na4 instead of b5, but black should probably go for typical carlsbad stuff like f5 f4 ig, maybe Bg4 to take because you still have your dark squared bishop so pretty sure black would be better there because white is just not gonna get Kh1 Rg1 in time, if he defends the knight with the queen, then maybe go Bh5-g6.

If b5 then ...cb and black's winning, surely? Forced win for black?

Avatar of nTzT
Optimissed wrote:
Qxe7checkmate wrote:

I'm kinda confused on why white played Na4 instead of b5, but black should probably go for typical carlsbad stuff like f5 f4 ig, maybe Bg4 to take because you still have your dark squared bishop so pretty sure black would be better there because white is just not gonna get Kh1 Rg1 in time, if he defends the knight with the queen, then maybe go Bh5-g6.

If b5 then ...cb and black's winning, surely? Forced win for black?

Not sure what you see, but cxb then Nxb4 and white is doing completely fine and black isn't really better anymore since he has to give up one of the bishops or deal with Nc7

Avatar of Optimissed

Maybe I've got it wrong because I didn't try to work the moves out too carefully but I thought if b4 ...Nxb4, black drops the B back to b8 and will play a6 and Bg4 so maybe after Bb8 then h3. So a6 from black and black plays moves like Be6, Qf6, b5 or maybe b5 straightaway and black has a potentially winning Q-side majority, bishops against knights with open diagonals, potential attacks on white's king and should be much better. I don't think the slight weakness of black's isolated pawn is significant. I know I could be wrong though.

Avatar of Optimissed

In the game as given, black plays Bg4 immediately.

Avatar of Optimissed

What did the engine prefer?

Avatar of nTzT

I mentioned it in one of the earlier comments on page one and I also have the game posted there. Qf6 is preferred by the Engine, at 22 Depth I think.

Avatar of Optimissed

Again without use of an engine, 
b4 ...cb
Nxb4 ...Bb8
Rfc1 ...Bg4
Nc7 ...Bxh2 looks promising for black, so like I suggested, white maybe has to be careful and play h3, never gets the N to c7 and black keeps the two bishops and probably wins.

Avatar of Optimissed

OK I see the point of Qf6. Thanks.

Avatar of Optimissed
Optimissed wrote:

Again without use of an engine, 
b4 ...cb
Nxb4 ...Bb8
Rfc1 ...Bg4
Nc7 ...Bxh2 looks promising for black, so like I suggested, white maybe has to be careful and play h3, never gets the N to c7 and black keeps the two bishops and probably wins.

Sorry I forgot a pair of moves. I'm having a browser problem. Bxh2 happens if Nxa8. Have to go.

Avatar of Terminator-T800

I would hurry up & try to do a rook swinger . Or smash his doors in to drag him out

Avatar of MisterWindUpBird

Nice thread!!  - Firstly because I've recently been trying to work Cambridge Springs motifs into my Semi Slav defence, and it's interestment to see some of the weirder developments. Secondly, it's gratifying to see the computer analysis of the later stages of this nice black victory. Even at 2000+ that miserable engine is caning you. (inaccuracy, inaccuracy, absolute drivel, missed win etc.) In response to the original question, the black bishop and queen look quite promising there, don't they. But that annoying pony needs to go. Tie a kamikaze do-rag on your white bishop. Banzai, Your Holiness...

Avatar of nTzT
LastKingofEngland wrote:

Why don’t you stop masturbating to chess

Why should I?

Also, hope you feel better soon. Better enough that you don't hate yourself enough to waste your own time making a troll account for attention.

Avatar of nTzT
LastKingofEngland wrote:

You sir are blocked and reported

Avatar of LM_player
...g7-g5!? is what I would probably choose, threatening to play ...g5-g4 which chases away White’s knight, soon attacking with Qh4 or Qg5. In Qh4, After the Queen and Bishop’s checkmate threat is blocked with g2-g3, I’d wedge the Queen on h3, and follow up with ideas of ...h7-h5 or LSB attacks to exploit the hole on g2. Alternatively, ...Qg5 after ...g5-g4 looks good, because of pawn advances like ...f7-f5 and ...h7-h5, and Black will likely do more kingside damage than White can do Queenside damage.

White’s attack on the Queenside is slow, and Black’s kingside pawn storm can happen very quickly, especially since king safety is not too big of a priority for Black, and since Black already has 2 Bishops and a Queen aimed towards White’s kingside with only 1 piece defending.

Unfortunately, I can’t see so well passed these abstract, yet signifcant ideas. And I have a slight feeling that this plan may not be entirely sound. Maybe White could lock the pawns up, or weave his Queen back into the kingside, leaving Black with an unstable overextended position. I’m really not sure, and can’t really plan so far ahead.

But I would still play the move because there still seems to be good practical chances for Black, and possibly a crushing attack.