The Status of Female Players in Chess

I think that males have a make-up more prone to fragile self-esteems/egos, but, in the end, personality as a whole affects ego more than gender, and males are simply more prone to the type of personality that harbors a fragile ego.

I am not saying that gender does not influence, more that personality influences ego to a greater extent. 

I have to stand up for the guys a bit on this one.

I think there might be a point in this having to do with the male ego but I don't think that men would have more fragile egos. I think it could have something to do with what defines us. Women are often judged by their apperance and social status ammong other things so of course these things affect our self esteem alot. Men on the other hand are judged in general by what they accomplish wich makes their accomplishments more important to their egos or self esteem wich makes men in general more competetive. 

Well said neneko. Its not about the intrinsic male qualities, its more about the way we are bought up according to gender. The are many subtle differences. As a father (and a reasonably good one in my opinion), i occasionally smacked my son, but never my daughter. If my son fell over as a toddler, I would say "Come on lad, your a brave boy". My daughter would get lots of hugs and "There there baby girl". You could say that this is bad parenting but they are both functional teenagers now, and a result of my gender socialising. (And they both love me)

My son plays rugby and takes it quite seriously, winning being quite important to him. My daughter plays netball, and considers it more of a chance to catch up with friends, the game being almost inccidental. When I look at it, I would probably have to say my daughter's attitude is better.  Losing never spoils her day, like it does with my son. 

Besides cultural explanations ( that are probably important too).

I think the biggest reason is biological, men are more competitive than women. ( I f you think that this is also cultural, we disagree). Men care a lot more about any sports or games in general and they hate to lose more than women do.

 Some people also say that men are on average better on math ( and worse on language skills), but the evidence is not strong enough yet ( in my opinion). So that could be the origin too.

That doesn't mean that someday a woman can be world champion.

i discovered that Reb is "not available for challenge" when i tried.

sure, he's rated 500 points  better than me, but i would like to have seen how much of that is hot air.

i do insist on white, however - i gotta have some chance

       I was fortunate enough to raise four daughters. Each learned to play the game, and three truly enjoyed the concept. They played to explore the variations of the game, such as Najdorf,Queens gambit, and poisoned pawns. The drawback they had in attending tournaments, were the rigid egos that refused to accept them as fellow chess players. They played for the love of the game and to test any new found tactics that they may have discovered. You ask why there aren't many women who play in tournaments. My daughters felt that they were not welcomed by the majority of players, and that many of the male players were afraid to be beaten by a girl. When it is socially acceptable by those who play the game to have women in attendance. Then those women who play will attend.

Reb, there are 3 Polgars and what--several hundred male GMs.  For an analog, when Butch Cassidy and the Sundance kid faced off against several hundred of even you could argue inferior Bolivian regulars, who won?

The only woman I ever saw play at a tournament wound up marrying a TD, after which she dropped out.  In the case of this particular woman, I suspect she was not motivated by love of the game as she did drop out.  At the same time I saw several hundred gentlemen play.  Being outnumbered will cause funny anomalies. 

so are we talkking ability or something else?

IMHO FWIW, which ain't much.

    hmm i have no idea if i know what im talking about and i know not all women are the same but from what i've seen from my sister and I is just a difference in styles of games.

       What i mean is that when i bought Halo 2 she bought Viva Pinata (which i think is a good game anyway) and when i got Starcraft she got Chocolateer. I dont know maybe there are not as many women interested in the battle concept as men.  Also many women i've met seem less competitive in the way chess is competitive so maybe thats why?  Also chess has very negative stigmas and even though i also bring up the fact that the russian mobsters play chess it never seems to get anywhere and my sister is much more concerned about her popularity than i ever was.

    Hope i dont offend anyone im mostly just comparing my sister and I.   Anyway someone mentioned it earlier (and a lot of these things) its probably largely a product of social conditioning.  Girls can play chess just like Boys can play with barbies but they just dont.

I don't know about that. I have a feeling it'd ruin my game since I'd always be out of pieces.

The original question posed by Unbeliever was NOT about relative inferiority/superiority of a gender, it was about possible reasons why women are so underrepresented.  I think it's a great question, and I've noticed the same thing at our local chess club in the Detroit area.  A *possible* explanation might be the type of men who hang out at the chess clubs, as well as the banter that goes on between some of them during games.  There are ALL KINDS of men at the chess clubs, and some of them might be somewhat intimidating to women.  (Hell, some of them are intimidating to me!)  And the banter (i.e. trash talk) could well put off many women.

My $0.02. 

"Viva Pinata"

 What a sweet, funny name for a game.

I think TonyPetro hit the nail partly on the head. To excel, and advance, in chess, one must be a tournament player.  For men, in general, tournaments are competitions pure and simple. They play to win.  For women, in general, they are social events in which you compete.  This is partly the reason why there are separate women's tournaments.  The social aspect takes precedence over the competitive aspect. While winning is, of course, nice, for women, often the act of competing, and interacting with people with similar interests, is fulfilling whether you win or lose. So, women tend to gravitate towards the more social, often less serious side. As the tournaments get more serious and the results become more important (in order to advance), the less appealing tournaments become.  Of course everyone's different and some women will compete for the sake of competing only but because this is the exception rather than the rule, you see less and less women climb the upper rungs of the chess ladder.

OK, as to social introduction suppression, expression, and repression (they are different) read no further then here. http://nesara.insights2.org/Monarch.html

Chess now take a back seat to NWO... The illuminati... satanism... the occult... CIA... Manchurian canidate... and so on and so on... might explain why women don't play chess, There typically seen as the altar of man rather then the high priest that enters... It's all really quite interesting. 

 Heart Disease is more prominent is more prominent in the male gender, but that does not mean that being male causes heart disease, they are simply more susceptible to the factors that cause heart disease.  Being male, in itself, will not give you heart disease, as being male, in itself, will not cause "fragile ego syndrome (FES?).

I believe we are talking at Cross-Purposes, gender influences, to a small extent, "fragile ego syndrome", but being male does not stereotypically make you have "fragile ego syndrome".  Males are simply more likely to be susceptible to the factors that cause a personality susceptible to "fragile ego syndrome", because of a plethora of social expectations and stereotypes.  Gender does not completely influence, but its effect is not entirely absent.  I apoligize if I have somehow miscommunicated my purposes to you. 

Thinking back to my experience with Chess Club in high school, I can agree with some of the other women's comments.  Once I had played (and beaten) a guy, it was rare that he'd ever play me again.  Ultimately, it came down to the point where I would have to play the odd guy out once everyone had paired up, or I'd have to play the chess coach. (Which unfortunately did not teach me much.. other than how to lose gracefully!)