Yeah I would add a bit more to the skill amount because if I remember correctly the us government wasted taxpayer dollars to see if the game was of chance or skill. Turns out its skill based at all but the lowest levels. ( note I have won a lot of money off of my friends from playing against them)
Why poker is not only randomness / skill 100 %.
Sort:
jetfighter13 wrote:
Yeah I would add a bit more to the skill amount because if I remember correctly the us government wasted taxpayer dollars to see if the game was of chance or skill. Turns out its skill based at all but the lowest levels. ( note I have won a lot of money off of my friends from playing against them)
Ye, noted haha, I stopped playing in internet with about 150$ bancroll, from which I only could get 85$ after all taxes from game taxes, bank...the best way to earn money in poker is to play against noobs, and probably thats not new for u
Jan 14, 2014
0
#5
Very much not old I tend to find them in spades... NPI no pun intended
BulgarianMachine wrote:
poker is a pure skill game in the long run. for average people without math background, it's easiest explained like this:
in the long run, every participant of the game experiences the same distribution of cards (as the cards ar distributed randomly). the decisive difference between 2 players therefore ain't the cards he gets, but the actions he takes.
with that said, the long run can be brutally long. I advise you to never start playing PLO. it's like the crack of all poker variants.
This is incorrect.
Over the long run, there is both more than enough of a skill element, AND a sufficiently large unskilled population to offset it, that a skilled player is certain to have a +EV, provided he plays properly at all times.
There is a significant difference between this statement, and one that claims that over the long run poker becomes a game of pure skill.
BulgarianMachine wrote:
poker is a pure skill game in the long run. for average people without math background, it's easiest explained like this:
in the long run, every participant of the game experiences the same distribution of cards (as the cards ar distributed randomly). the decisive difference between 2 players therefore ain't the cards he gets, but the actions he takes.
with that said, the long run can be brutally long. I advise you to never start playing PLO. it's like the crack of all poker variants.
1 - correct, but the growing curve (graphic) is better with the players who use the theory win in long term and as much as they are more skilled to read the opponents hand. But biggest earnings in poker always come from pple who dont know theory or even rules.
i wouldnt say its PURE SKILL but it has important amount of skill since there are more factors to consider(thing that only few pple do): correct bancroll administration, good table seeking(with more action).... not talking about knowing all the theory and odds, ...the image given by u on the table...etc etc.
BulgarianMachine wrote:
the problem with hold em is that it's very tough to make $$$ online nowadays. the game has evolved so much since 2003.
I also used to like OMAHA Hi-Lo, only problem i remember was the lack of noobs that play this game on the net... on the other hand this was many years ago and the game was growing in number of players
You can go on google and type what ever user name you used when playing poker and get some interesting information. It may tell you what percentile you were in and also your tendency how to play good starting cards.
I used to win at poker but as I got older many of my skills evaporated and when I played I do not win enough to make it worthwhile. [I mean back a few years ago when you could play if you lived in the United States]
BulgarianMachine wrote:
ponz, i actually doubt your skills evaporated that much to make such a difference. it's just the games that got harder.
for example, when i got into PLO in 2008, i was making around 4'000$ a month playing .025/0.50.
half a year ago it was just simply impossible to get anywhere near that at 0.25/0.50 consistently without rakeback. win rates have decreased significantly as there is not as much fish anymore & the regs got way better.
Im scared of that u might be right, but poker is every time more popular in TV and there are always noobs, pple who is starting playing it because of propaghanda... but i guess harder to find in high levels. And soon i guess USA will make it legal(not only Nevada) so it will contribute to fish growing.
Jan 14, 2014
0
#12
There is still a major luck factor, ESPECIALLY in Omaha Hi/Lo. I was at a $4/$8 Limit 1/2 Kill Omaha Hi/Lo game while waiting for the evening tournament in Tunica, MS in 2010 at a WSOP Circuit Event. This was a 1/2 Kill hand, so it was a $6/$12 hand. Bidding was calm on the pre-flop. I had A336 Double-Suited. Flop comes down, it was Q45, giving me nut flush draw (it wasn't the 45 that was suited, so no straight flush). There was some heavy betting, but no max-out (it was max 4 raises). At this point, there are 5 of us left. The turn paired up the table, people now going for full houses. Raises maxed out (I called, never raised) and so it was $60 to see the river. Probably a dumb move on my part staying in. I believe it was down to 4 now at this point. Two people had Full Houses. One had A2, then there was me. Guess what the river was? A DEUCE! That card basically said "F*** YOU" to the A2 holder. He needed a 3, 6, 7, or 8 for half the pot, I needed a deuce, don't recall the two full house hands, but the board was Q45Q2, and I got over $250 for the hand (Lo half of the pot).
Poker is not 100% skill. I'd say closer to 80 to 85%. There is definitely a luck factor. One of my worst moves in all of poker lead to one of my highest ever payoffs in a single hand. Of course I've won far more than this before in a session, but for one hand, I believe that's still a record for me.
There is luck in poker! Trust me!
Want a horrifying story on the other side? 720 player $20+2 tournament. Down to the final table. 8 of us left, I have the 3rd most chips. KQ Suited (Spades). 2nd highest stack goes all in pre-flop. I call. His hand, KQ (a club and a heart). Flop - Junk (2 clubs). Turn - club. River - club.
I say it again, it ain't 100% skill when KQo beats KQs on an all-in pre-flop.
Anyone know anything about the USA might make poker legal again?
If this happened I think it might be fish heaven!
Jan 14, 2014
0
#14
I assume you mean online. It's legal in person. Just go to Vegas, Atlantic City, Mardi Gras Casino in Charleston, WV, Tunica, Reno, Cherokee, etc.
@thrillerfan - bad beats are parts of the game, i lost with AA in the casino of Barcelona (in my birthday) against 22 in a 60+10 tournament (yes, thats why only for birthday: 60+10 ).
We were 70 total or something like that. prizes were 7 first. So i was going for prizes, my stack was around12.000 chips, close to promedium and blinds were 300/600 and we were full 2 tables (18 players) and I was last to act after 2 raises - as soon as I had AA i didnt had to think much about... in big blind i re-raised to all in (to make dem fold and go showdown with only 1 player) but an 2 called me: first with AKoff and the second with 22. flop was something like that : K53 ... turn: 2 river: J .. and bye bye to the tournment. The lucky donkey with 222 suddenly had nice amount of chips and finished in third place. Sad ? we all have a bad beat stories man....
I have a friend who made it to the Final Table in the World Series of Poker. The one won by MoneyMaker. Right off the bat he had AA. He bet and Money Maker had TT and thought to himself he had one of the best hands in poker and raised all in. MoneyMaker caught a ten on the flop and my friend out of the final table.
About 3 years later I won a prize to play in a table [I think 10 or 12 players] with Money Maker one of them. He was the first one knocked out of the game.
Jan 14, 2014
0
#17
My worst beat was with a Kalashnikov , AK starters, and I got a full house on the flop some other bugger had for of a kind pure luck for him
ponz111 wrote:
I have a friend who made it to the Final Table in the World Series of Poker. The one won by MoneyMaker. Right off the bat he had AA. He bet and Money Maker had TT and thought to himself he had one of the best hands in poker and raised all in. MoneyMaker caught a ten on the flop and my friend out of the final table.
About 3 years later I won a prize to play in a table [I think 10 or 12 players] with Money Maker one of them. He was the first one knocked out of the game.
What's ur friends name ? Btw did u know Money Maked employed a a guy who supports him psycologically in tourneys (sorry bad eng. - i dont know the exact word for it), because Money Maker has problems with self-control in game and out of game
jetfighter13 wrote:
My worst beat was with a Kalashnikov , AK starters, and I got a full house on the flop some other bugger had for of a kind pure luck for him
we should create a bad-beat club, ... like a therapy against frustration in poker xD
As a fast introduction, I'm fallen in love with poker since i was 16 (4 years ago).
Here I'm talking about the Texas Hold'em No Limit (NL). To all who are poker players , they must already know that usually the important is how much they bet and if your move is going to be profitable in long term according to probability odds... so i would say in conclusion, that the skill goes about 40 % in this game. And only in a game between players with EXACTLY the same level and experience it can be 95 % randomness.
I stopped playing poker in internet because it was a huge addiction(earnings weren't that huge, mainly because I was playing in NL1/NL2 ) and because in spain we have to pay extra taxes (that donkeys in the governament changed the law 2 years ago...) about your earnings in poker. Btw my goal in life is, after finishing an engineer career - to get a good job, travel to a country with low bet-games taxes and start play professionally. It's only a dream ? Maybe, but I know my possibilities, I know im good enough and ofc. Ill find a way to reach my goal. But for now I'm only reading books about poker.
Believe me or not, this is a 5% chess-related thread: I started to play chess 2 years ago in this side, exactly 1 day after I stopped with poker.:P