choosing black when issuing a challenge is not available

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TheGrobe

Yeah, I only checked the archives of the original complainants in each thread.

Writch
TheGrobe wrote:

There have been a number of threads about this and in each of the ones I've seen, out of curiousity, I've taken a quick look at the games archive of the original complainant to find whether they've overwhelmingly chosen White or Black.  In every case except for this one the answer has not been a surprise.


Interesting factoid. Quite revealing indeed.

And great proactive action, Erik et al. At the very least you've irked those that deserved irking - the Golden Rule applied where they forgotten it.

xxchessne1xx
erik wrote:

the reason is that some people are abusing the option to just play white only. as an example we found one member who had more than 1,000 games as white... and 19 as black. 

who goes around at a chess club and says "i'll play you, but i get white". it doesn't happen. you sit down, then you decide by luck who plays white, and you setup and play, then reverse when you are done. 

if you want to play one particular color you can do so as unrated (for practice), or you can directly challenge someone with a specific color. 

i'm open to hearing reasons for adding this back, but removing it removes abuse and confusion. 

thoughts?


why should it matter if someone wants to play exclusively white or black? what does the the rating really count for anyway?

 

i like to play an equal number of games with each color, but it seems i'm always assigned black.

 

or somedays i might won't to work on a particular opening and i'm always assigned the other color.

Maradonna

Is there really an advantage playing only white at our level? I always thought it only really matter at a much higher level.

Jamesh20000

I recently picked up chess as a hobby where I try to learn openings and basic ideas... yeah, I mostly stuck with white because I don't have the time to learn both right now and I'm still a begginer at White (under 1400). I think the recent change is bad because it will give me a harder time at focusing on learning deeper into neuances of variations from positions that I am comfortable with and force me into a situation where I almost always find myself in new positions struggling to find a strategy to hold on to. Not everyone can learn the game without some solid repetition and there's enough variations that I am encountering as it is to try and learn where things evolve to when I make move x or y as it is.

 

p.s. when I first noticed this new change I played as black (lost after trying something foolish) and the fellow I was playing with refused the rematch (ignored it)... so... not only was I forced to play from a position that I'm not interested in working on, but I didn't get to practice the one I am interested in. A great experiance there (not really).

Maradonna

Jamesh20000

you can choose a colour in unrated games.

*edit* I don't think you lost that game because you played black - it was more that you gave away your queen for free ;)

Jamesh20000
Maradonna wrote:

Jamesh20000

you can choose a colour in unrated games.

*edit* I don't think you lost that game because you played black - it was more that you gave away your queen for free ;)


I was already unhappy to be forced to play black so I decided to see if he takes with the right piece. If he had taken with the Rook instead of the Knight, it would have been a smothered mate... I saw the knight, but was in a bad mood and went with a silly gamble.

p.s. how can I know my level in any color if all I'm doing is play unrated games?

trigs
Schachgeek wrote:

I always select "random" anyway, but people will continue to abort games if they do not get the color they want. That's nothing new!


then you block those people.

Maradonna
Jamesh20000 wrote:
Maradonna wrote:

Jamesh20000

you can choose a colour in unrated games.

*edit* I don't think you lost that game because you played black - it was more that you gave away your queen for free ;)


I was already unhappy to be forced to play black so I decided to see if he takes with the right piece. If he had taken with the Rook instead of the Knight, it would have been a smothered mate... I saw the knight, but was in a bad mood and went with a silly gamble.

p.s. how can I know my level in any color if all I'm doing is play unrated games?


 If your playing against people rated 1300 and beating them, your stronger than 1300.

CousinJesse
[COMMENT DELETED]
ChessColin

Hi Erik and others

 

Look I don't have a problem with needing to be seen not to be cheating - by playing one colour - I had not been aware of the rule you all refer to.  And as we have seen from the 'posts' the 'rule' can easily be worked around.

 

I reiterate my main point - I am now 'stuck' in a playing black all the time.  I have switched to 'unrated' but have now played 4 games in a row as black.  How do I even re-set to alternating black and white, if I cant opt for one colour?

 

By the way, quite a few of my opponents 'abort'.  So, no-one has to play a forced colour, they chose it.

 

Further thoughts?

Colin

pleasant_business

my thoughts on the matter: 

as i understand the change, a computer calculates who gets what color based on previous games. this means it is not random, but rather weighted in such a way that the person who has played white the least in recent matches will play the white pieces.

hypothetically speaking, if i wanted to play white and i was assigned black, i could abort the game and join another, until i was placed in a game where i had the white pieces. however: i should think that my aborted games (those games where i have the black pieces) would not count as a "game played" with the black pieces. therefore, when the computer calculates who gets the black pieces, it would decide increasingly more for me. i could continue to abort games, but eventually my recent games would be so weighted against white that I could only hope to be assigned white if i played against another "aborter". 

if this is the case (and i hope it is) then this is a self-fixing problem. after a while the people who abort games with black pieces will no longer be assigned white pieces in any game. they will then either have to suck it up and play some games as black or find another site. 

i sincerely hope that nobody actually would consider finding another chess community over this... even if you are practicing a specific opening as a certain color, playing the other color for a bit is not that big of an issue. tactics still apply with the black pieces. positional play is still comparable. basically: playing the other color is not that big of a sacrifice. 

this is a positive change, and i endorse it. 

PrawnEatsPrawn
ChessColin wrote:

Hi Erik and others

 

Look I don't have a problem with needing to be seen not to be cheating - by playing one colour - I had not been aware of the rule you all refer to.  And as we have seen from the 'posts' the 'rule' can easily be worked around.

 

I reiterate my main point - I am now 'stuck' in a playing black all the time.  I have switched to 'unrated' but have now played 4 games in a row as black.  How do I even re-set to alternating black and white, if I cant opt for one colour?

 

By the way, quite a few of my opponents 'abort'.  So, no-one has to play a forced colour, they chose it.

 

Further thoughts?

Colin


 

I don't understand, you've had 6 whites in your last 10 games. Please explain.

 

ChessColin

Hi

I did say my last 4 (now 5) games.  And these have occurred since I raised the issue.  I dont deny my previous play with White as a preference - see earlier posts!

Colin

Dazza668
erik wrote:

the reason is that some people are abusing the option to just play white only. as an example we found one member who had more than 1,000 games as white... and 19 as black. 

who goes around at a chess club and says "i'll play you, but i get white". it doesn't happen. you sit down, then you decide by luck who plays white, and you setup and play, then reverse when you are done. 

if you want to play one particular color you can do so as unrated (for practice), or you can directly challenge someone with a specific color. 

i'm open to hearing reasons for adding this back, but removing it removes abuse and confusion. 

thoughts?


This is totally wrong! This amounts to censorship and I thought this was a democratic site. People should be allowed to choose whatever colour they want. We should not be dictated to. If you want to play white (or black) all the time, then no-one is being forced to play you. They choose to play you. Put it back the way it was. Give us our chess rights and freedoms back!

rooperi

I'm totally in favour of this change. Good job, staff. I'm not clear whether this applies to online as well?

CyberSensei
You can still select your 'preferred color' when you challenge other members directly with left-click.
ThreeNailz
Dazza668 wrote:
erik wrote:

the reason is that some people are abusing the option to just play white only. as an example we found one member who had more than 1,000 games as white... and 19 as black. 

who goes around at a chess club and says "i'll play you, but i get white". it doesn't happen. you sit down, then you decide by luck who plays white, and you setup and play, then reverse when you are done. 

if you want to play one particular color you can do so as unrated (for practice), or you can directly challenge someone with a specific color. 

i'm open to hearing reasons for adding this back, but removing it removes abuse and confusion. 

thoughts?


This is totally wrong! This amounts to censorship and I thought this was a democratic site. People should be allowed to choose whatever colour they want. We should not be dictated to. If you want to play white (or black) all the time, then no-one is being forced to play you. They choose to play you. Put it back the way it was. Give us our chess rights and freedoms back!


Hilarious!!

erik
Dazza668 wrote:
erik wrote:

the reason is that some people are abusing the option to just play white only. as an example we found one member who had more than 1,000 games as white... and 19 as black. 

who goes around at a chess club and says "i'll play you, but i get white". it doesn't happen. you sit down, then you decide by luck who plays white, and you setup and play, then reverse when you are done. 

if you want to play one particular color you can do so as unrated (for practice), or you can directly challenge someone with a specific color. 

i'm open to hearing reasons for adding this back, but removing it removes abuse and confusion. 

thoughts?


This is totally wrong! This amounts to censorship and I thought this was a democratic site. People should be allowed to choose whatever colour they want. We should not be dictated to. If you want to play white (or black) all the time, then no-one is being forced to play you. They choose to play you. Put it back the way it was. Give us our chess rights and freedoms back!


even in a democracy there are rules in place to limit the impact of people's decisions on one another (can't smoke in restaurants in the USA, for example). choosing your color impacts everyone else - from the selfish play of white only to ratings manipulation to confusion - there are negatives. we have decided they outweigh the positives. and you can still choose the color you want in unrated and direct challenge games. 

TheGrobe
algernonn wrote:

I don't think it's a good idea. For instance, I want to play against a friend KG only as Black, because that's the situation I encounter KG, I never play it as White. We match perfectly, since his main weapon as White is king's gambit, while I've always found quite difficult as Black to defend against White's fierce attack.  I don't see why this should not be allowed.


My understanding was that for direct challenges (i.e. to a friend) and unrated games you're still able to choose your colour so you should still be able to do this.