Can Science Disprove a Miracle?

A thought experiment to illustrate a point.

For this thought experiment let's assume that Jesus actually turned water into wine. Now let's assume that through time travel a scientist today is able to get a sample of this wine within an hour of that transformation.

The scientist studies the sample and sees that it is actually wine.

Can the scientist then give an accurate description of the process that led to the making of that wine?

Water turned into wine by power of being God. In other words by a miracle. Just to clarify the process.

inb4 the lock

Why involve time travel? It muddies your thought experiment.

Let's just say that someone has the water turned into wine by Jesus in bottle. The wine is analysed in a lab and is found to be normal wine.

Could the scientists figure out the process used to turn water into wine with current technology and understanding?

Probably not.

But if they know for sure that it was water and became wine, then obviously some process was involved and therefore that process can be known (presumably Jesus knew the process) and so then it only becomes a question of whether human brains are capable of that level.of understanding (again, presumably they are if Jesus did it), and time.

So your answer is no. Thanks for playing.

To be precise, my answer is yes. Just takes time.

Did you actually read.my post?

I read your post, you said no.

The thought experiment was that the event was a miracle, not a process.

First, in order to avoid confusion, my answer is: yes they could work out the process if a) it wasn't beyond human ability to do so and b) they had time. But could they figure it out right away, probably not. Hopefully that's clear now.

Second, your thought experiment asked the question could they give an accurate description of the 'process'. So ...

I will answer the question in the title. " Can science disprove a miracle?"

So you are saying that with just the sample scientists could determine that it was a result of water being directly turned into wine by way of a miracle.

How?

1. Yes, if it is not a legitimate miracle. 2. No, if it is truly a miracle then it violates the rules of science already. The basic definition of a miracle is a physical act that cannot be explained.

So no, since the assumption is actual miracle.

Who are you asking?

You, how?

But that question is different to the OP thought experiment, bith in its original time travel form and my revised form. In both of those cases it was already known that Jesus had turned the water into wine, the only unknown was by what process.

You are now asking a different thought experiment, which is: if I give you a bottle of wine, and you analyse it and it is normal wine, and then I tell you that it had previously been water but Jesus had turned it into wine, could I find a way to disprove your claim? The obvious answer is no, because its an unfalsifiable hypothesis. In the same way you couldn't disprove that invisible, ethereal gremlins carried my dropped keys to the floor rather than gravity.

In others words, no, you can't disprove a miracle in the sense that you can't disprove any unfalsifiable hypothesis.

However, if the water had in fact been turned into wine (thus it is actually possible), then science could figure out how it was done if there is enough time.

It is not known by the scientist. The scientist must figure it out on their own.

In your version a document stating that this wine was created out of water by way of a miracle.

I think you are just intentionally dodging the question, so unless you give a direct response I will assume you are just a typical troll.

*sigh*

I think I've answered your questions very clearly. But I appreciate my posts are sometimes difficult to follow.

Again, to clarify:

If you give me a bottle of wine that had previously been water, then whatever the process was that led to water becoming wine will eventually be understood through the scientific method, it's just a matter of time and effort.

I think that because I can't see how any material change would not eventually be unravelled by the scientific method. I can't even conceive of a material issue that couldn't theoretically be understandable by superhuman intelligences with infinite time by the application of the scientific method.

You never said how they would know it was God created wine.

Evidently you are unable to accept the assumption of a miraculous event that only God can perform. I wonder why you are unable to give up your assumptions for this experiment.

Well, now you've added another element: that the water was turned into wine by a proces only understandable by an omniscient being.

In that case the thought experiment becomes redundant: If scientists were given something that only omniscient beings could understand would they be able to understand it? Obviously not.

Could it be that the water turned into wine is such an object? Possible, I guess.

So is it possible that a miracle could be understood? Yes.

Is it also possible that a miracle might never be understood by anyone buy buy omniscient being Yes.

But I see no reason to assume that any miracle would be incomprehensible to any non-God being. It seems more plausible with it involving.material objects that it would be comprehensible in time.