Covid-19 Discussion (moderated)

Once again, I lifted that link from the other Covid thread.  So, rather obviously, I did not *choose* it, I saw the link and read it.  Somebody else choose it, and I gave them credit in the other thread for posting a good article.  It is a good article.  You should try to read it and take it in, instead of judging it.

Good news.

Our family contracted Covid and in our experience it wan't any worse than the flu.  In fact, I have had flu bugs that were much worse.  We used masks (which do not stop the virus btw) and practiced social distancing and still caught the bug.  Unless you are very elderly and have severe health issues, there is nothing to panic about.  The regular flu kills the elderly and people with health issues every year.  Seriously, this is nothing to freak out about.  Now the vaccine, you folks have at it.  They will have to put me in restraints for me to ever take it.  I believe most of this is hype in order to control people.  Compliant little robots get used to the cage after proper conditioning.

We need to get our lives back and establish herd immunity.  This is not the black death.  People need to interact with each other.  People need to work, kids need to be in school, we need to to shop, go to outdoor event......etc.etc.  They have managed to keep people holed up long enough for the new flu season to start.  Isn't that great.  Working from home is way overrated.  It is time to live again even if there are risks.  Enough of the gilded cages of our homes.

This isn't politics.  This is life and how our future is going to live.  Hiding in our houses in fear is not my idea of La Vita Bono.

There are 300,000+ dead, oops wait, it's almost 340K dead now...another few weeks, another Vietnam War's worth of casualties, but "Seriously, this is nothing to freak out about. "

Trying to pretend like it's nothing because you had a relatively benign experience is near-sighted.  If it's all hype to control people...to what end?  Who is behind it?  How are they pulling this off?  Occam's Razor should be your trusty sidekick. 

I think that individual people should definitely have the option to refuse a vaccine.  The Christian Scientist and Amish communities are also allowed to cling to backwards ideas that endanger their lives in the name of freedom, and you have every right to do likewise.

That doesn't mean a third of the country needs to be ignorant, though.  If the claim is that Covid and the 1%-3% death rate are fine and dandy, and you feel justified in risking not just yourself but every stranger you come into contact with, then the sub 1% that get severe vaccine reactions are certainly also fine and dandy...it's a much lower risk and the outcomes are also less severe.

By Xmas morning, there will be 80 million Covid cases worldwide, and by New Year there will be 20 million cases in the US.  The fact that the US has almost a quarter of the world's cases with only 4% of the world's population is due to people thinking exactly the way you do.

Do you drive?  Do you have friends or family who have served in military or as police officers?  Have you ridden a roller coaster?  Kayaked, rock climbed, surfed, boogied boarded, gone camping, etc.?  Where would be without those who explored the seas and founded new lands, launched men into space, risked their money on business endeavors, etc. etc?  Many of the things we do in this life come with risks, but a life not lived is no life at all.  Locking everyone up is not the answer.  Why on earth do you and others continue to inject politics and religion into this.  This is about humanity and how we as humans are going to proceed.  Do you think is realistic to lock down the world?  Viruses mutate, the goal posts will continue to be constantly moved  and the lock downs will continue perpetually. 

I have done a deep dive on this and there is much to be concerned about in data and stats that is being batted about.  I have tried to step back from my natural biases in this evaluation.  You really have no idea what the world thinks nor what I think.  The minds of men are deeper than covid.  Obviously, based on your comments, you believe those who disagree with you are intellectually and socially inferior.   You must overcome that bias.  There are those who just go along with the popular groupthink within their circles and there are those who have come to their conclusions after analyzing data from a variety of competing sources.  Many of the sources have an agenda, so you must try to get past that the best you can. 

Please step back from your politics and religion for just minute.  Like the flu bugs, new strains will continue to perpetuate, lock downs will continue indefinitely and fear will rule the day.  Herd immunity and a return to normalcy with risks must happen or we will not live free.  

You keep saying it’s political to call Americas response to Covid bad. It’s not political: it’s objective fact. We have over 330,000 dead americans, 200,000 new cases a day, and its only going up (indicating were no where near fifty percent infection, let alone hErD ImMuNiTy).

And your insistence on a 1% death rate ignores several factors: (1) how widespread and contagious this is (1% of 200k is worse than fifty percent of 100), (2) how many people survive, but need ventilators, overwhelming our healthcare system, (3) long term damage to vital organs like the lungs, brain, and heart among those who survive, (4)that nobody knows if they or a loved one will be in that 1%, (5) that pretending this isn’t serious because it affects those primarily suffering from underlying conditions is callous in that it excuses the avoidable deaths of hundreds of thousands of people so that others can go to a baseball game or some other luxury and (6) that this could’ve been avoided or significantly reduced with a better social attitude.

Yes, I drive.  I don't have to know anyone in the police or the military, because I was in the military...were you?  As it happens, my two best friends since high school are a retired Chief Master Sergeant and a CHP Captain.  Oops.  Time to check your own bias.  I have ridden every roller coaster ever put in front of me.  Yadda yadda yadda.  Your assumptions are baseless, and come from a narrative being fed to you, that everyone that disagrees with your position are fearful sheep (and probably that we are all living on welfare, too).

This is not some argument about being adventurous.  It's a ridiculous argument.  You might as well tell someone to jump into a live volcano in the name not being afraid, same exact points apply .  There's unreasonable fear, and there is being smart.  Protecting yourself from a pandemic and living a life without adventure that isn't fulfilling are not comparable points.  Not even remotely.

You need to realize that you are just another partisan arguing that you are the one without bias.  And believe me, it takes a lot of herd mentality to buy the notions you tried to float here.  

Obviously, we will agree to disagree.  You can continue to keep making your ego-centric assumptions and put people into their proper boxes based on your perceived stereo-types. While I disagree with you, I enjoy the fact that we can continue to freely exchange ideas and opinions here and now.  It is my sincere hope that this continues.  That is what freedom is all about. 

Yes, I was employed in a very risky occupation. Of course, should, I state what that is, I will neatly be assigned to your proper filing cabinet.  Car accidents. poor diets, alcohol and drugs and other previous flu bugs kill or have killed more people than covid, but people make choices in how their lives should be lived.  While you are holed up in your humble abode and having your goods and services delivered.  Others will do their shopping, dining, attend functions etc wherever it is permitted.  Our family got covid and fully recovered, despite all the proper protocols.  I am not sold on what is being done to our people.  For those willing to go beyond lip service and feelings, when you follow the money and organizations involved, it is pretty evident what is happening worldwide.  I wish to congratulate you on your persistence.  You will never change your mind, nor will you change my mind.  Thanks for the chat. 

What do you mean by “when you follow the money and organizations involved?” Would you care to elaborate?

A similar thread 👇

Some of you here are also the BEST contributors (like @btickler,

@ExploringWA in the below link  👇

https://www.chess.com/forum/view/off-topic/covid19-and-chess-around-the-world-52513044?newCommentCount=2&page=85#first_new_comment 

Because this thread is about Covid-19.  What-aboutism is not going to work here.  The problems you listed (and the not-really-problems you also listed) are addressed elsewhere.  

Doubtful .   This happens all the time.  Somebody comes in and casts aspersions and implies various conspiracy theories are at work, then runs away when their feet are held to the fire and they have nothing.  This crap only works when having PBRs with your "hey, I have a GED" buddies on Friday night.

First, because it's quite rare these days that half a million die in a war...*especially* on the US side of things.  Second, because 450,000ish children are *reported* missing every year, but less than a tenth of them are actually missing, and 99% are recovered, so that's completely misleading and not as big an issue as you made it out it be.  In fact, less than 400 children per year are actually abducted by strangers in the US.  Third, abortions are legal, so you'll have to eat that one.

Don't let the door hit you on the way out.  If you have anything to actually stand behind, go for it.

Not according to US law, nor the majority of US citizens by poll.  Now take that topic elsewhere.  No second warning.

Covid is still the larger issue by a couple of orders of magnitude currently.

Sounds like you should start your own thread then and evangelize away, since your criteria are subjective.

Nobody cared about child trafficking until it was used as a cudgel to attack the response to Covid. “Child abduction is worse, so who cares if 250,000 people die” was the talk of last March. It is nothing more than whataboutism designed to avoid any action on other subjects?

And we can do two things at once: we can have stay at home orders, mass testing, contact tracing, and invest in vaccines while giving the CIA, FBI, and state agencies the funds to investigate human trafficking.