Serious scientific study is taking place there. The chart seems to include everything in the universe is open for study ! I've seen people immediately shut their minds when view several terms that are a part of religion. Notice nowhere in the Chart is DOG made mention off. Rather the members are of all sizes and shapes, contributing in their own way.
Does True Randomness Actually Exist? ( ^&*#^%$&#% )
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Sillver1 wrote:
“True randomness does exists.
True randomness via a binary system does not exist.
The Universe is not random.
Chess is not random, although some of my moves are apparently.”
———
how did you reach your opinion that true randomness exit? in other words.. where do you see true randomness? The reason I’m asking is to learn your meaning of ”true randomness”
If we go to the pub, armed with some dollars and a die, we arrive and roll the die, if it is 1-3 I buy the first round, if 4-6 you do... then the dice rolls under the pool table... then the girl playing pool starts talking to us... then her husband arrives... while each of these items are predictable they are also random.
Another example, a predicted pattern of weather... link > https://www.chess.com/forum/view/off-topic/new-zealand-weather-warning makes a random shape that some can see a pattern in.
Thee_Ghostess_Lola wrote:
I found this venn interesting....
Ghostess, in the Venn Diag, Noetic Science places itself at the centre of the Universe. At this point, my scepticism gets a boost.
Seems OK to me if that is your line of thinking, although it looks self-serving, it is correct.
Feb 13, 2020
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#868
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The Global Consciousness Project (GCP, also called the EGG Project) is a parapsychology experiment begun in 1998 as an attempt to detect possible interactions of "global consciousness" with physical systems. The project monitors a geographically distributed network of hardware random number generators in a bid to identify anomalous outputs that correlate with widespread emotional responses to sets of world events, or periods of focused attention by large numbers of people. The GCP is privately funded through the Institute of Noetic Sciences[1] and describes itself as an international collaboration of about 100 research scientists and engineers.
Feb 13, 2020
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#869
I'm not endorsing any mission statement but simply providing information that's relative to the topic. Research, measurements made using random number generators, the study of the minds workings, is being done scientifically.
Will always be those who dismiss the research out of hand. Not disagreement, but out right rejection of a philosophy results in bias. It works the same, from either view. Both parties put on their blinders.
The research is an attempt to take measurement, add data, offer a model. Any conclusions need saving till the 1st definitive results are in.
In effect, the project is trying to prove an order exists in what is thought to be random data. What this order is can be interpreted in any number of ways, but what's important is perhaps the Math's can recognize a pattern.
"1st definitive results" seems premature? even "definitive results" seems optimistic, maybe with something like maths, but with thought processes and any other science proofs of concepts and proofs of results takes years and many trials and experiment to try to un-prove them and only then do they become an "allowed" assumption quasi-fact at x level, with qualifiers or am I taking this too far?
Feb 13, 2020
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#871
@Optimissed, I can understand having a strong belief in such things. I have myself in the past.
But I have found that I can't justify these beliefs in an objective manner. And in my world view, objective facts need objective justification that holds water. Desirability and intuition do not suffice for that.
What can you offer? Do you think any of your non-mainstream beliefs are testable?
Sober analysis has not found some of the Global Consciousness Projects claims to be justifiable. See http://www.jsasoc.com/docs/Sep1101.pdf
Feb 13, 2020
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#872
MustangMate wrote:
In the minds eye, a fractal is a way of seeing into infinity. The Mandelbrot Set is the most complex object in mathematics. An eternity would not be enough time to see it all.
The Mandelbrot Set is interesting, particularly its fractal properties. It has an infinite amount of structure. It is complex in some sense although having an extremely simple definition. But in all honest it cannot be in a meaningful sense "the most complex object in mathematics", because there is no such thing. Depending on your definition, there is either an infinite hierarchy of complexity or an infinite number of equally complex objects. There are many infinite objects with infinitely complex structure.
Computer science has been remarkably profligate in alternative notions of complexity, all meaningful in their own way. Here is a list of (distinct!) complexity classes of computer algorithms. (And here is the professionals' longer list of 544 complexity classes!). It is to be noted that the computer scientists' basic notion of complexity is about how hard questions are to answer with computers, so this is not directly comparable.
Feb 13, 2020
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#873
"The Mandelbrot set is the most complex object in mathematics, it's admirers like to say"
This is the actual, full quote. Shame on me for leaving off the second part. 
Somehow perhaps I just knew ... ? Argue all you like Elroch, that "there is no such thing" and for you it is very true. For others, they often find what is the most in ANYTHING because the model fits. So it does exist, not universally, but individually. And there also exists those who believe NOTHING as such can possibly exists. 
ppl find mandelbrot sets beautiful (or eloquent or exquisite or...)....and that falls partly under the philosophy of math (more so aesthetics philosophy). the beauty part has nothing to do w/ the math itself.
same thing goes for stuff like physical infinity (big or small). science has no bizness in it. they can try to imagine it (and take wonder) but they cant even comprehend it....let alone u/s it.
so....no credit where credit isnt due.
(....patiently waiting to get told off)
Ghostess hittin on all cylinders again, love it. Give me personal stories of randomness any day, so much more meaningful. Sigh
ok. sure. ppl being random. does it make the world go around ?
for you...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9SYZR1or6M
You can run, you can run
But you will never, ever run
Truly free
It breaks my heart
Unbridled future's not the plane we see
I remind myself
That I still
Want to grow old
From recklessness
To blanket
And bowl
Finding a home
You can run, you can run
But there will always be a pull at the rein
From the heart to the head
There is a wilderness of thought
Unframed
Like a wish, like a hope
That I know cannot come true
I remind myself
That sometimes it's the things we don't do
That define us too
I found this venn interesting....