Omfoc

 "I personally Don't believe that, if one perhaps - does Not have 'Faith'.. That, God/'JC'.. will have nothing further, to do with that person;" Of course not. God is a loving God, full of mercy and grace, He offers us salvation! 1 John 1:9  If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. But we have to accept his gift, the alternative is ultimate separation and suffering in hell! And this is just, we sinned, it is only by Gods grace and mercy that God even offers us the gift of salvation. But God is just, he cannot save us unless the punishment is dealt. Jesus had to die on the cross and resurect for us, in our place. 

that's cute

You may be right.

Fb 45. I'd agree actually . I've come to the conclusion that everything is natural but it's no more than that .

On the other hand I guess md is correct in that I don't believe there is any possibility the supernatural exits .

I guess though if I have any faith at all its in observing what is and if I see God I'll be honest . You have to be to know the truth .

I do see absolute beauty in people . Perfection . Love .

It would be nice for that beauty to be divine but my logic tells me no .

Maybe through Omfoc I'll find out .

Sa 46.

I see your logic but my friend you are living in a fairy tale . I hope it brings you joy though .

suddenly tom discovers that the visible spectrum of light is only a tiny proportion of it, and also that not everything occurs in nature, he is learning, albeit sloooooooooooooooowly.

it's like popping a table tennis ball on the sea surface and waiting for it to circle the globe.

Pulp 54.

I'll answer your question and comment on your statement . You say life is you but is that so ? What is this I that you refer to?

I'll go into more detail .

well you are a man of science I'm sure. So we are this bunch of cells and chemicals and so on right? Where suddenly does this I come from?

It's a trick of nature riight? If that's so then maybe this I doesn't exist at all. All there really is is life. This life isn't just you my friend it's we. 

So as long as there is life this we we will exist. 

And even if life ever does disappear the natural forces that created life will still exists.

So what's real and true will always be here. 

so nature plays tricks now ?

what's life? Well I guess that's what we are trying to establish. My logic though tells me there is no order except survival of the fittest but on the other hand people are capable of incredible acts of beauty such  as sacrificing their lifes and also of completely incredibly complex tasks deliberately. 

Has causality been changed through this incredible evolution. My own feeling is no but it's undoubtable that people are beautiful. But then hasn't nature always been beautiful. What's more beautiful than a sunset? 

i can't look at anymore! this thread is one giant oops moment.

well not deliberately but what works best remains. The idea that we are this entity in control perhaps helps us sustain our life and therefore it continues to exist.

What we are is awareness right? And yet for most of our lives we are on autopilot. It's the rare times we notice we are alive and think hey what should I do next?! 

Self consious right? 

I'm personally giving, a 'higher probability' that 'Tom' is playing a BIG 'Trick' on us all, {'Jedi' mind trick?}; By, appearing to 'come-to-the-brink' of being persuaded, otherwise; Only to 'back off' in the next {usually several hours later}, 'thread'; And, repeat his virtual 'mantra'; "Everything-is-natural."

  The other 'lesser' possibility; Is that 'Tom' is mesmerized, by the 'simpler' things in Life.. {I hope to post a 'gif' illustrating that, next!}; In which; Poor 'Tom'; Cannot distinguish, the 'trees' {our 5 senses of awareness}; 'From-the-forest'..Eg. All other, energy spectrums.

how cute is that Sa? Thank you. I'm sincere buddy. Maybe crazy, maybe ignorant, maybe wrong but I'm sincere. 

I'm continuing my search. I know you have very set views on divinity, I guess it's fair to say I have very set views on the absence of divinty but I like when you talk about things I can relate to. Maybe we can find some more common ground and introduce each other to new understandings. 

I enjoyed the picture thank you. 

Oh and by the way if I see God when I omfoc I promise I'll tell you and I'm not ruling it out. 

I guess this observing my flow of consciousness is just being aware , being mindful . I do wonder if that's healthy . Perhaps to desire to live in the present moment continually is unhealthy . Maybe we do need to take time out to analyse things .

Now and again when I'm faced with a very difficult decision I do in fact analyse things . I don't experience a choice about it though . I just feel I have to .

I get things wrong . I guess everybody does . I'm not at all sure though that worrying helps that .

I guess part of what this thread might bring me is more of an understanding about mindfulness .

To be honest though I feel I'm here to find out who I am . What I am .

Cm 57.

Neither hawking not Einstein believe in free will . I don't either .

I'm not absolutely sure though that I believe in determinism . I believe in causality . However quantum physics as hawking pointed out means only mass or speed could be determined as it's impossible to establish both simultaneously.

I have to admit though that even a person like myself that doesn't believe in free will can see that humans are capable of incredible understanding .Though we may not be able to control what we want we are certainly capable of creating incredible beauty and being incredibly beautiful .

You did Ag !

Cm 64.
No buddy but I like your gentle acceptance .

Anyway I can sum that whole conversation up as God does or doesn't exist .

Let me say this . This thread is about what I observe . Those guys coming here tell me what you observe . I don't want to know what the bible says . That's about what other people see . Tell me what you see . If you observe God then tell me how . Put yourselves out there guys . I'm going to

Some 67.
Nice analogy . Nothing good came quickly my friend .