Good luck when we're lifting people out of poverty at Walmart rates of pay.

Human beings have value because they are human beings.The plutocrats don't own their wealth,they are only stewards of community property.Their control of that wealth can be revoked by the community at any time.I want to maintain the capitalist system but the people at the foundation of  that system have a right to the basics of survival. Food,shelter,health care,and education are their birthright,and if the current system has dealt them out the system must change. People come first,not business.

People are not statistics. If one person falls below the minimum standard of survival,the system is a failure. The system is expendable people aren't. If it doesn't soot our needs,time for a new system.

It's spelled "murkuh"

Cencored, I didn't study Economics in the US and nor did I finished my studies but I know a thing or two on the matter buy reading a few more books (both Russian and American). Can we at least agree not to attack each other's characters from now on and have a more civilized discussion? As far as my biases, I never claimed to be completely unbiased although I try hard not to be. As I mentioned before, I'm not a rich guy myself but I completely understand how that rich guy feels and how those who want more money out of that rich guy feel. I guess I'm just not an envy person but I don't want his money. :) But I would also hate to be in his shoes to create wealth and see an increasingly larger portion of it taken away. This is why I don't even bother creating wealth. I'd rather spend my time gettin' a few more rating points that will never be taxed away. Or would you advocate taxing the top 1% of high rating holders and spread the wealth around too? :)

that is exactly right; handouts discourage personal initiative and create dependency. the people who benefit are actually the liberals who create these stupid programs; they get praise and a feeling of "accomplishment" like they "made a real difference" (which I guess they did, in a bad way)

Economics is a game. If we decide the rules are unfair we can change them at any time. Wipe the slate clean,and start over .

By the way, all that being said, I do acknowledge that our present system, which is fueled by debt, has a lot of inherent, systemic problems that are likely to precipitate its collapse. Here's an interesting cartoon on the matter. Both educational and entertaining. They also made more on the matter that can be checked in related sections of YouTube. I recommend to watch them and ponder on that information. As the saying goes, in the long run we're all dead. :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqvKjsIxT_8

Please be relevant, helpful & nice!

the US is the biggest example of a dog eat dog society. Nothing is going to change, unless Trump is President.

Our economics was made for a bygone post ww2 era which no longer exists. Our system of economics based on greed does not work in our global village of today. The trouble is there is not the will on the part of nations to change.

The system is broken. We have 46 million people living below the poverty line and we are the richest people in all of history. People have lost their careers,not to other people but to machines and this is just the beginining. I propose a new system of enlightened capitalism that gaurantees all people a minimum stake,we can afford it easy.If we don't give them what they have a right to they will take it,just wait a bit and they will take a lot more. The billonaires have control of vast wealth,but they serve as stewards at the pleasure of the people. It's time for a change or one will be forced upon us.

Also, I agree that poverty is a big problem and it does need to be addressed. I'd even go ahead and agree with Gandhi's quote. But how we address the poverty is an entirely different matter. I hope that we will be able to do so through ingenuity and innovation in technology. I place my hope in scientists and engineers - they are the creators. Here's an interesting and inspiring talk on the matter. This guy discussess things in greater dept and detail. This is about an hour long presentation that's definitely worth the time to see... I'm sure many of you will broaden your perspective since he's not very well known.

Robert Zubrin - On the Way to Starflight Economics of Interstellar Breakout

yes the system is unfair : today 330 - 46 millions leave above the poverty line. 

Importing poverty massively seems a good way to repair this unfairness : one billion of African are under the line, just if you accept only 10% of them as refumigs, problem solved.  10% x 1 billion = ?   100 millions.

                46 + 100       = ?   146 millions

Almost 50% of USA will be under the line , not unfair 12%!

And when 99% will be under the line, it means left wing leaders will succeed on one thing : conquest of the power!

pb solved. 99% poverty is fair !!.

nb : that is a static view, for advanced graduated ph.D., just project that instaneously figure, let us say in two years, with 8 children per wife, 50 millions of potential mothers coming from Africa. It gives ??  hmmm ????

either : 70% of total poverty in fifteen years

either : fB is faChist, richs are villains selfish, left wing program saves mankind, experiments before were not socialists, etc ...

nb: What succeded in Europ, creating massive poverty, will succeed in USA, if same paths are used, same results.

pb for Europ : USA with 70% of poverty will not be able to face challenge of India, Russia, China, etc ...

There is one truth : if left wing sharings programs, taxs, etc ... will create wealth, it is for the leaders. (check french experience).

The biggest illusion of all times is to thing middle class can survive to left wings programs, for a good reson : to keep power, after taking it, left wing leaders need more and more poors proletarian to survive.

It is the only pb with democracy, no solution founded since 1840 Proudhon "property is robbery", may be truth, but unoperational.

interesting next pdt elections : will the biggest and most powerful empire of all times, in terms of wealth, arms, finance, control of the total planet, will commit suicide ?

Africans as group are the best educated class in the US. Theyare doctors and lawers. Like that.

Michael Moore once said the reason we have so much poverty in America is because the government wants to get young men to join the army. Of course serious tax reform would eliminate most poverty. Simply eliminate income taxes for those making less than one million dollars a year and making everyone who makes more than a million dollars a year pay 20 percent of their income for taxes would automatically give most people substantial pay raises. Put in a value added tax on top of that and you would have quite a substantial amount of money to use for social services to cure many of the ills of our country. Poverty is increasing in America because we are going away from Keynesian economics and going back to Austrian economics. Politicians are simply not going to make changes in the way we do business. This has been shown time and time again. Obama ran on a platform of change and yet all of these 8 years are very similar to Bush's 8 years. If we closed our eyes we would not know who is president, Obama or Bush.  

We can do both, but cutting the military budget drastically is much more imperative in that there really is nothing good about a country which is constantly threatening other countries. Diplomacy will always be fiction for a country like that. It's like helping a gangster avoid tax evasion while allowing the gangster to terrorize their neighborhood.

I have to disagree with your premise, badenwurcta. I've had this argument many times. Most nations throughout history only go to war in defense of their country being invaded by another country. The few nations who are the invaders does not make it a "human inevitability", no moreso than the few people who are serial killers makes being a serial killer an inevitability for the anyone you've known in your life. We have to change our country into one only willing to war to defend itself from attack, and the first thing every citizen can do towards that goal in not to vote for pro-war parties like the democrats and republicans.

You cannot legislate people out of poverty. If you give "poor" people (I assume they are already on some form of government assistance ie free housing, free food, monthly payment for each child they can't take care of and a welfare check) another 20k, what makes you think that will lift them from poverty? Will they now go out and get a job and lose all their free shit? Not likely. More likely is that they buy a nicer car, bigger tv and spend more on "entertainment" In fact those that could have kept on working will now say "f#ck this I'm just gonna not work and get my check." Socialism cannot work in the real world. Your numbers don't add up anyway. You can't tax people 15% that already don't pay any taxes (which in the US is nearly 50%) . And the more people not producing income the less you have to draw from. Even if you tax all millionaires at 100% you still wouldnt come close. Stupid plan. Just like all socialist plans, you will quickly run out of other people's money.

What's amazing to me is I work in inner city areas and the housing sucks, but they don't pay for it, guys like me do with our taxes. But guess what? In most of the parking spaces are cars newer than mine. In most of the houses are 4-8 kids, I would have loved to had more kids but you know what I COULDN'T AFFORD IT. Personal responsibility cannot be forced on people. Bad life choices have consequences and to make the rest of society pay for your misspent youth is absurd. Education and opportunity abound in this country, and if more people spent their time figuring out how to make something of themselves and contribute to society instead of bitching about how the world owes them a lifestyle, we wouldn't have as many "poor" . Have to go now, I have a job to do so that I can pay taxes to support the poor and so I'm not poor.

No matter what you do, some people will always end up wasting a lot of their time on computer games and drugs etc. It's human nature.

What you need to do is to make the low end salaries higher.

Not tax rich people and give the poor people money for free.

But if you raised salaries of McDo-Wallmart jobs - with unions or legally set minimum wages - then most of the non-educated would go for it.

Also is important to make it easy for companies to fire people easy - it makes them more willing to give people a break and show if they can cut it.

Then benefits should be for the lowest of the low. Like people who really can't do any kind of job, no matter how hard they try.