Why is it so hard for you to accept that evolution is fact?

However, I do firmly believe in evolution as the only possible pathway towards life, higher life and consciousness. I also see no problem in religious people believing in evolution, since God's method of Creation may have been via evolution.

Because it's not real. I'm still a monkey.

#28 No i mean there are also denialists

I would say that the real question is whether evolution comes about by survival of the fittest of genetic mutations which occur purely randomly or is there is some kind of hidden principle which actually guides mutation and therefore guides evolution.

Looking at it purely logically, Pegasu, if such a hidden principle of guidance were to exist and if it existed so as to only give a very tiny percentage advantage to favourable mutation, then that tiny advantage may well be completely undetectable by scientists, although it might give the favoured mutations an appreciable advantage in survival, when the tiny advantages of each generation are multiplied throughout thousands of generations, each generation maybe being 18 to 20 years or so on average.

So over 1000 generations, taking maybe 20,000 of our years, there might be some kind of supernatural guidance merely as a logical possibility, due to the very definite advantage it would bring with it, in survival rates and therefore in the chance of passing itself along the evolutionary strand of that particular family of critters such as ourselves.

If you see what I mean? My wife's a Christian but also a scientist. She must be since she has an MSc. I should ask her what her gut reaction is to what I've witten here.

It's not that I doubt it's a fact. I just don't like the attitudes of people who think having a certain kind of education gives them a moral superiority over people who don't. I'm a revolutionary like that. Let power belong to everybody, not just the highly educated elites. Knowledge is a kind of power after all, and power commonly puts the possessor of it under a certain suspicion of corruption.

I'm sure my friend's thread is more of a reaction to a completely immoral thread on the subject, which we all (or some of us) know and dislike so much. Maybe it's intended as a more healthy alternative, where people can air their views and really try to do that and to learn, without getting thrown off by some idjit who thinks he knows better and imagines he's intelligent.

To be completely truthful tho, I firmly believe in the genesis account of Creation where God created the entire universe in 7 literal days, with the animals being created on the 5th and 6th day, and Adam and Eve right after the animals on the 6th day.

Animals have evolved and adapted, to better suit their environment over the years, but not into other species

#45 so that's why some people are so hot lol

It's not nearly as grainy as Turkish coffee but it does taste a lot like Turkish coffee. I went to Istanbul and Antayla a looonngg time ago and loved the country.

I've been through Antalya but never stayed there. A friend of mine very recently holidayed there and enjoyed it. I haven't been to Turkey since 76 but I do have permanent invitations to stay at people's houses there, which I shall probably never take up again. I do love Turkey.

In 73 I stayed with the family of a professor in Kadikoy Moda, across the Bosphorus from Istanbul. The ladies with the diamonds at the dinner party liked me because, they said, my English was so good. Very kind of them. Turks pronounce their language rather phoenetically, rather like well spoken people in Northern England pronounce English. I also stayed with a family in Adana, that year.