Please fix the pairing process in Daily tournaments.

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JimRichmond

I keep getting paired with the same opponents round after round or every other round in every tournament I play. That should not be happening and wouldn’t in an official OTB tournament.

Fiendamental

Looking at the pairings, you seem to be paired in a double round robin fashion which is why you are playing the same person twice. Once as white and once as black.

 

If you are looking for just one game per person, then maybe there is a Swiss tournament which pairs people based on their performance for the next round.

JimRichmond

I don’t have a problem with the double round robin, I have a problem with the pairing putting me up against the same players in multiple, sometimes consecutive tournament rounds in a row. 

In one tournament I was matched with the same person for 6 straight games instead of two, in others it has been 4 straight games instead of two, and in another I’m playing my 4th game against the same opponent with a gap of one round in between the two sets of games. 

This should not be happening.

Fiendamental

"I don’t have a problem with the double round robin, I have a problem with the pairing putting me up against the same players in multiple, sometimes consecutive tournament rounds in a row. "

 

But that is how it is done. You play player 1 as white or black, then you play them again with the other color. 

 

Look at these pairings for top GMs.

https://worldcup-results.fide.com/results 

Fiendamental

"In one tournament I was matched with the same person for 6 straight games instead of two, in others it has been 4 straight games instead of two, and in another I’m playing my 4th game against the same opponent with a gap of one round in between the two sets of games. "

 

Did you look at the available players with similar ratings? Were there enough? Please show the tournament so we can look at it. I am not part of chess.com but I could take a look. It seems like there just might not have been enough in your rating range.

 

Also, there might be some desired rating pairing set so if you have it set to -50 and +100 you won't get paired with players 200 lower or higher. This would limit your chances of playing different people.

JimRichmond

You are not understanding what I am saying. I know each round of a tournament has one game as white and one as black. That is ok. But getting stuck repeatedly playing the same person when there are plenty of other players that you have not played is wrong.

Fiendamental

Can you provide an example tournament?

JimRichmond

To be extra clear, I use to play in person tournaments and this doesn’t happen because they make sure it doesn’t. In small tournaments there can be exceptions, but those are very small (example - in one tournament there were 4 people in a 4 round event so you had no choice but to play someone twice).

 

JimRichmond

Two events that I am currently playing.

Just a tournament and 2020 tournament 

JimRichmond

In Just a tournament Round 1 and Round 2 I was paired with American Aquarium. Then in Round 2 and Round 3 I was paired with The Green. There were 64 participants at the start so there was no reason for repeat pairing except the program is crap and doesn’t account for the issue. 

JimRichmond

In 2020 tournament I have been paired with jkieranm in rounds 2 and 4. There are 8 players still in it meaning we could have easily been paired with other players, but the crap programming failed again.

Fiendamental

I think that is a result of a small tournament using a big tournament formula. If you had more players, then you wouldn't be paired with the same people in your group as often. 

 

Think about top GM tournaments. Should Carlsen and Nepomniachtchi be paired in the same group with 64 players in it? No, what they do is have Carlsen play in group A of 32 players and Nepomniachtchi in group B of 32 players. Add Caruana and Ding Liren, and now you have a top player in group A section 1 and 2, as well as in group B.

 

Continue that and you will see that this prevents a battle of the top players in the beginning of a tournament. You have to win in order to be paired up. This is what happened to Carlsen in the past World Cups. 

 

I would suggest doing a single round tournament if it is going to be a knockout and you want to play different people.  I am not sure I understand the point in doing elimination style with double round robin as a formula.

 

If two top players can beat two lower level players, why waste a round and make them beat the other lower level player they would easily win against also?

 

Another thing is they might be pairing the same person to make sure the playing accuracy is relatively the same. It might be easier to enforce the fair play policy.

JimRichmond

You obviously are missing the point.

There are plenty of participants in these tournaments. There is no reason these repeated pairings should happen if the program was written correctly.

JimRichmond

Have you ever played in a live face-to-face over the board tournament? You would get to experience how proper pairing is done.

Fiendamental
JimRichmond wrote:

Have you ever played in a live face-to-face over the board tournament? You would get to experience how proper pairing is done.

 

Dude, I DO know what you are talking about. MVL never had a chance to play Ding Liren in the 2017 World Cup. I don't know 100%, but I think this is very similar (not exactly the same) format chess.com is doing with the tournaments you are complaining about.

 

Why not look at it this way, there are going to be different types of tournament formats. If you don't like the fact you are being paired up with the same opponent 3 or more times, then why don't you join a tournament which has 9 rounds with 10 players? If it is a 1200-1600 I would be more than happy to join if you need more players. Then, there could be a second tournament with the same players but reversed colors. 

 

Problem solved, no additional programming needed. 

Martin_Stahl
JimRichmond wrote:

I keep getting paired with the same opponents round after round or every other round in every tournament I play. That should not be happening and wouldn’t in an official OTB tournament.

 

 

Daily tournaments don't look at previous rounds and are directly paired by ratings at the time of pairing. It's a pretty simple algorithm and it is very possible to get paired with someone you were paired with in previous rounds. 

 

https://support.chess.com/article/501-how-is-seeding-and-group-placement-determined-in-multi-group-tournaments

 

It can be problematic in smaller group tourneys sometimes.

Fiendamental

"Daily tournaments don't look at previous rounds"

So, there is no way to set a single round robin daily tournament which has different opponents? My example above was 10 players, 9 rounds but smaller groups could have 6 players and 5 rounds or if even number give a player a bye.