Ponziani opening traps

GDring

Yes, thank you, we know all that but what would you recommend after 6Qb3 please?

DeirdreSkye
GDring wrote:

Yes, thank you, we know all that but what would you recommend after 6Qb3 please?

 

   Common sense chess: 6...Nb6 7.cxd4 d6 8. Bb5 Be6. 

poucin
GDring a écrit :

Yes, thank you, we know all that but what would you recommend after 6Qb3 please?

"We know all that" : u know it so u think everybody does?

If u know it, u should know how black handles these positions, so why asking about Qb3 instead of thinking a bit?

pfren
GDring έγραψε:

Yes, thank you, we know all that but what would you recommend after 6Qb3 please?

 

Certainly not allowing white to take your knight.

What is wrong with something like 6...Nb6 7.cxd4 d6 or 7...d5? The Queen is not terribly well placed at b3.

6.cxd4 is the best way to keep things level, and Black has a choice. I think the most interesting is 6...Bb4+ 7.Bd2 d6 (I see no need to take on d2 yet).

If Black has any sort of problems in that position, then I'm sorry to say that I am too weak a player to spot them.

This line is great for Black, for several reasons:

- Full equality.

- Not a sterile position- both sides can play on.

- Can also be used against the Goring gambit.

- Very easy to play properly- effectively there is no need to memorize lines.

What white has achieved? He cannot keep his space advantage after ...d6, he has not managed to create structural weaknesses to Black, he is not ahead in development... Fortunately for him, he has no weaknesses, either, else the whole opening should have been labelled as a total failure.

GDring

Yes, I agree, that's very useful thanks.

My old engine gives that position +.25 (probably as white has easy development and more space) but all very temporary and fairly equal as you say.

DeirdreSkye

God help us from Ponz's menace once he sees all these! I think I'm going to need a new bottle of wine! And quite a strong one!

ponz111
pfren wrote:  ponz in red
ponz111 έγραψε:

1. And yes, I can prove an advantage where everybody else has failed to do so! 

 

2. What is not so easy is to test me to see who is correct?--you or me [ponz] Come on play me and test out your claim that I am wrong...!!!

 

1. Sure! You can even prove that pancakes are immitating the earth's shape in your parallel universe.

 

2. I will gladly play you, sir. My tariff for pompous guys is $ 50/game. I sincerely hope you will accept.  Thank you I will accept your offer to test the 9. ...Bg4 line in the Ponziani. Do you take master card for your $50.00 payment?  If not I can send you a check for $50.  Just message me and we can work out the details of payment.

Pastuszek
ponz111 wrote:
pfren wrote:  ponz in red
ponz111 έγραψε:

1. And yes, I can prove an advantage where everybody else has failed to do so! 

 

2. What is not so easy is to test me to see who is correct?--you or me [ponz] Come on play me and test out your claim that I am wrong...!!!

 

1. Sure! You can even prove that pancakes are immitating the earth's shape in your parallel universe.

 

2. I will gladly play you, sir. My tariff for pompous guys is $ 50/game. I sincerely hope you will accept.  Thank you I will accept your offer to test the 9. ...Bg4 line in the Ponziani. Do you take master card for your $50.00 payment?  If not I can send you a check for $50.  Just message me and we can work out the details of payment.

I'm glad the quarrel will end now. Hoping IM pfren will be man enough to play this game eventually!playhand.png

ponz111

IM pfren  Here are some of your quotes: Post 455 "In the main top level encounters Black equalizd pretty easily, and in the rest of the games with

 9. ...Bg4 (mainly from correspondence chess) White has scored pretty horribly."  Then you mentioned 4 games where White scored zero against

9. Bg4.  Also note what you said in Post 457.

Here is something you said in Post #492 "Pulling fictitious games out of one's butt is not proof of anything." [of course I did not pull fictitious games out of my butt -- that was regarding a game played by Caruana in chess.com's Titled Tuesday!]

Here is your statement in Post #496 "I will gladly play you sir, My tariff for pompous guys is $50/game. I sincerely hope you will accept."

Well, Mr IM phren I have accepted your challenge and showed I will send you the $50 either by master card or by personal check.

I am waiting for your response!?  Let's both investigate your move

9. ...Bg4 and see if you are correct regarding the good play Black  will get with that move?

Pulpofeira

Are you solving the issue by playing a game? You could win the theoretical discussion, if possible, and still lose the game. It happens every day (Yermo dixit).

Pastuszek
Pulpofeira wrote:

Are you solving the issue by playing a game? You could win the theoretical discussion, if possible, and still lose the game. It happens every day (Yermo dixit).

Enough talking, lets play!

Colin20G

bump