rychessmaster1 wrote:
none of the above
Nf6 move 2
Of course, You'll want to know how to defend against the Caro-Kann Panov-Botvinnik Attack if you play that line.
Scandinavian defence, which is best in your opinion d8, d6 or Qa5 ?
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Oct 16, 2021
0
#43
Qa5. - it's challenging for the opponent, you can align your rook with his queen.
Qd6 - for real high-class players.
Qd8 - too passive, opponent won't let you get bishop out and play e6 like you wish.
Qa5 (best way for Black to play, the con is that everyone knows it) Qd6 (the Queen is more exposed but it has more central influence) Qd8 (it's the worst retreat, you are down 2 tempis just for the sake of opening up the d-file which sounds ridicolous. On the bright side the Queen is safe)
Oct 16, 2021
0
#45
blueemu wrote:
rychessmaster1 wrote:
none of the above
Nf6 move 2
Of course, You'll want to know how to defend against the Caro-Kann Panov-Botvinnik Attack if you play that line.
icelandic gambit exists -__-
I would go with with Qd8 but Ne4 is just caro kann so you have to learn that as well. 1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Qxd5 3.Nc3 Qd8 4.d4 c6 5.Ne4
I don't play the scandi but considered it. The thing I can't get over is if 3... Qd8 it looks like white is a whole extra move ahead over and above moving first. Just look at the position after 3... Qd8 and have a good think.
When the queen goes back to d8 and u look at the position as if it were the beginning of the game (which it is basically), u have to be honest and say "what da fugg is goin on here?"
MisterOakwood wrote:
Mistakes in the comment section!
The Qd8 scandinavian does NOT give white a tempo. Quite the opposite! Black gainst a tempo in the main line and in exchange; white get to but his dark squared bishop wherever he likes.
The mainline scandinavian:
As we can see here, the queen ended up on d8 either way! Almost all GMs tend to play this way as white; not only did he gain a total of 3 tempos on the queen, but he also managed to force damage to blacks pawn structure.
Thus, black does not play the Qd8 scandinavian to give away a tempo, but to earn one!
Pros for black: Gains one tempo, Solid pawn structure, white blocked his c-pawn, the queen remains flexible and its very offbeat!
Cons for black: White get to put his c1-bishop on a more active square, good development lead.
Overall: This may be a bit to passive for some players, but it is rock solid! This is also a relatively unexplored line, so if you want to do your own research, this is the line for you. I think that black should aim for an improved caro kann structure by making use of the c8-bishop and putting it on either f5 or g4, trading the bishop, even for a knight is favourable for black because of the e6 and c6 structure.
That's Qa5 line not Qe8
He's obviously talking about the third move not the 8th
Interesting line, never faced it though, mostly cuz i believe the b pawn was born to be gambited on b4
Oct 17, 2021
0
#50
Kapivarovskic skrev:
MisterOakwood wrote:
Mistakes in the comment section!
The Qd8 scandinavian does NOT give white a tempo. Quite the opposite! Black gainst a tempo in the main line and in exchange; white get to but his dark squared bishop wherever he likes.
The mainline scandinavian:
As we can see here, the queen ended up on d8 either way! Almost all GMs tend to play this way as white; not only did he gain a total of 3 tempos on the queen, but he also managed to force damage to blacks pawn structure.
Thus, black does not play the Qd8 scandinavian to give away a tempo, but to earn one!
Pros for black: Gains one tempo, Solid pawn structure, white blocked his c-pawn, the queen remains flexible and its very offbeat!
Cons for black: White get to put his c1-bishop on a more active square, good development lead.
Overall: This may be a bit to passive for some players, but it is rock solid! This is also a relatively unexplored line, so if you want to do your own research, this is the line for you. I think that black should aim for an improved caro kann structure by making use of the c8-bishop and putting it on either f5 or g4, trading the bishop, even for a knight is favourable for black because of the e6 and c6 structure.
That's Qa5 line not Qe8
He's obviously talking about the third move not the 8th
Interesting line, never faced it though, mostly cuz i believe the b pawn was born to be gambited on b4
Of course he is talking about the third move. But since the queen end up on d8 anyways, its wrong to say that it gives away a tempo.
Oct 17, 2021
0
#51
rychessmaster1 wrote:
none of the above
Nf6 move 2
You are a move off! Move 1! The Scandi is pure trash!
There are 4 good responses to 1.e4.
1...e5, 1...e6; 1...c5, and 1...c6. One is no better than the other three, but all are better than the other 16 garbage moves, including 1...d5?!
Oct 18, 2021
0
#52
ThrillerFan skrev:
rychessmaster1 wrote:
none of the above
Nf6 move 2
You are a move off! Move 1! The Scandi is pure trash!
There are 4 good responses to 1.e4.
1...e5, 1...e6; 1...c5, and 1...c6. One is no better than the other three, but all are better than the other 16 garbage moves, including 1...d5?!
Then would you mind explaining exactly why the scandinavian is "garbage" / "pure trash". Even strong grandmasters play it on occasion so I highly doubt its garbage unless you can point at something concrete.
yes the scandihoovian is kinda...nvm.
Oct 18, 2021
0
#54
MisterOakwood wrote:
ThrillerFan skrev:
rychessmaster1 wrote:
none of the above
Nf6 move 2
You are a move off! Move 1! The Scandi is pure trash!
There are 4 good responses to 1.e4.
1...e5, 1...e6; 1...c5, and 1...c6. One is no better than the other three, but all are better than the other 16 garbage moves, including 1...d5?!
Then would you mind explaining exactly why the scandinavian is "garbage" / "pure trash". Even strong grandmasters play it on occasion so I highly doubt its garbage unless you can point at something concrete.
Emphasis on "ON OCCASION" - Garbage can be played occasionally to try to "trick" the opponent, figuring they may be unprepared.
The Scandinavian is an inferior version of the Caro-Kann with wasted Queen moves, or an inferior version of the Alekhine where the Knight goes all over the place without enticing the pawn forward and claim over-extension. The Alekhine in and of itself isn't very good either, but the 2...Nf6 Scandi is an even worse version of it!
Go find me someone in the top 100 in the world whose PRIMARY defense to 1.e4 is anything OTHER THAN the Sicilian, French, Caro, or 1...e5.
I occaisonally play 1.b4 as White. It is also garbage. But I play it OCCASIONALLY! I do not make it my primary first move as White. Same concept. To give a comparison, 1.b4 has no refutation, but it is clearly inferior to 1.e4, 1.d4, 1.c4, or 1.Nf3. 1.f3 is just outright stupid and even worse than 1.b4.
1.e4, 1.d4, 1.c4, 1.Nf3 would equate to answering 1.e4 with the Sicilian, French, Caro, or 1...e5
1.b4, 1.f4, or 1.Nc3 would equate to answering 1.e4 with the Scandi, Alekhine, Pirc, Modern, or Nimzowitsch
1.f3, 1.h4, etc would equate to answering 1.e4 with 1...f6, 1...h6, 1...a5, etc.
So yes, the Scandi is not officially "refuted", but it still blows compared to the "big 4". When you have four legitimate options to 1.e4, why play any of the other garbage?
MisterOakwood escribió:
ThrillerFan skrev:
rychessmaster1 wrote:
none of the above
Nf6 move 2
You are a move off! Move 1! The Scandi is pure trash!
There are 4 good responses to 1.e4.
1...e5, 1...e6; 1...c5, and 1...c6. One is no better than the other three, but all are better than the other 16 garbage moves, including 1...d5?!
Then would you mind explaining exactly why the scandinavian is "garbage" / "pure trash". Even strong grandmasters play it on occasion so I highly doubt its garbage unless you can point at something concrete.
The Scandinavian is not garbage:
a) It has as good results as any other defence at club level
b) It is not winning by force for white
c) Strong granmasters plays it sometimes in competition games. The most recently one I remember was player by Rapport twice in the Norway Chess.
d) The World Champion, Magnus Carlsen played it atleast 3 times in the World Blitz Championship with great succes. In the interview he said "Im gonna continue playing this opening until someone prove me wrong". Guess what, nobody proved him wrong, and he faced very strong opposition (Nepo, Anand and MVL)
As you can see, if you like the Scandinavian there is no reason to not play it, it is a good defence, maybe objectivelly speaking it is slightly inferior to the "big four" but nothing major. In my opinion, in order to call something garbage or trash it has to be something loosing out of the spot. Surely not the Scandinavian.
the scandihoovian is dubious...at best.
Oct 19, 2021
0
#57
ThrillerFan wrote:
rychessmaster1 wrote:
none of the above
Nf6 move 2
You are a move off! Move 1! The Scandi is pure trash!
There are 4 good responses to 1.e4.
1...e5, 1...e6; 1...c5, and 1...c6. One is no better than the other three, but all are better than the other 16 garbage moves, including 1...d5?!
Uhhhhh
Are you reccomending the alekhine
Wtf
Oct 19, 2021
0
#58
rychessmaster1 wrote:
ThrillerFan wrote:
rychessmaster1 wrote:
none of the above
Nf6 move 2
You are a move off! Move 1! The Scandi is pure trash!
There are 4 good responses to 1.e4.
1...e5, 1...e6; 1...c5, and 1...c6. One is no better than the other three, but all are better than the other 16 garbage moves, including 1...d5?!
Uhhhhh
Are you reccomending the alekhine
Wtf
Nowhere do I recommend the Alekhine! Follow the quotes.
Rychessmaster1 said 2...Nf6.
I gave 4 moves on move 1 that are clearly better. Nowhere do I see 1...Nf6 in that list. 1...e6, 1...e5, 1...c6, 1...c5, where do you see the Alekhine in that list?
Oct 19, 2021
0
#59
ThrillerFan wrote:
Nowhere do I recommend the Alekhine!
This can be interpreted as "You should have played Nf6 on move one!"
Oct 19, 2021
0
#60
Freevision89 wrote:
MisterOakwood escribió:
ThrillerFan skrev:
rychessmaster1 wrote:
none of the above
Nf6 move 2
You are a move off! Move 1! The Scandi is pure trash!
There are 4 good responses to 1.e4.
1...e5, 1...e6; 1...c5, and 1...c6. One is no better than the other three, but all are better than the other 16 garbage moves, including 1...d5?!
Then would you mind explaining exactly why the scandinavian is "garbage" / "pure trash". Even strong grandmasters play it on occasion so I highly doubt its garbage unless you can point at something concrete.
The Scandinavian is not garbage:
a) It has as good results as any other defence at club level
b) It is not winning by force for white
c) Strong granmasters plays it sometimes in competition games. The most recently one I remember was player by Rapport twice in the Norway Chess.
d) The World Champion, Magnus Carlsen played it atleast 3 times in the World Blitz Championship with great succes. In the interview he said "Im gonna continue playing this opening until someone prove me wrong". Guess what, nobody proved him wrong, and he faced very strong opposition (Nepo, Anand and MVL)
As you can see, if you like the Scandinavian there is no reason to not play it, it is a good defence, maybe objectivelly speaking it is slightly inferior to the "big four" but nothing major. In my opinion, in order to call something garbage or trash it has to be something loosing out of the spot. Surely not the Scandinavian.
World blitz championship means nothing. Even at the GM level, you can play 1...a5 in blitz and win.
It has been used once in a world championship match in the last 40 years and Black lost (1995, rd 14).
It is still today almost never used in CLASSICAL TIME CONTROLS by the top 100 (again, blitz means nothing when it comes to opening soundness).
And lastly, club level statistics are rubbish. If you use club statistics, my over 70% score on the Black side of the Exchange French across roughly 50 games in the last 8 years would imply 3 exd5 is refuted. GM statistics show Black scores in the low 50s, which is still really bad for White, and it is that, not my own 75% score, that I use to back up my claim that the exchange French, particularly the symmetrical lines, is slightly better for Black because he can force white to commit first, unlike the Spanish Four Knights, where pure mimicking by Black is a blunder on move 7.
You have to look at the specifics of your statistical data before you can claim validity. Basing validity on 3 GM blitz games is like basing it on my 70+ percent score against 3.exd5 in the French.
I prefer 1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Nf6....
yeah this