Old sChOol face-to-face otb play is still the best anti-cheating software made.
And its backwards compatable for use on older models.
... but has limited availability in some markets. :-(
Personally, I could care less if my opponent uses an engine.
I look at it this way. They obviously suck at chess, otherwise they would not be using an engine.
So, when they use an engine, at least I have an opponent I can possibly learn something from.
Being cheated out of a game is no way to learn. You and Erik have no moral code.
That's not at all true.
The common dogma in chess is 'lear from your losses'. If you lose to an engine, there is still room to learn something.
And, it is definately less stressful than giving cheaters recognition. Let them live in their dark pitiful hole without a sound.
People should be given a choice as to whether they want to play chess programs or not. People who use chess engines against their opponents are very deceptive. That's the point you're missing.
I'm not missing it at all.
I simply don't care if someone is cheating against me.
And, since knowing for sure is out of the question, there is no point in getting all twisted-up over it.
Chess engines are stronger than the strongest human chess players. What are you learning from a chess engine that you have little to no chance at beating? You say that you don't care if your opponent's cheating, and any reasonable person would say that you should. Wouldn't you rather know if you're really playing a human or a computer?
Personally, I could care less if my opponent uses an engine.
I look at it this way. They obviously suck at chess, otherwise they would not be using an engine.
So, when they use an engine, at least I have an opponent I can possibly learn something from.
Being cheated out of a game is no way to learn. You and Erik have no moral code.
That's not at all true.
The common dogma in chess is 'lear from your losses'. If you lose to an engine, there is still room to learn something.
And, it is definately less stressful than giving cheaters recognition. Let them live in their dark pitiful hole without a sound.
People should be given a choice as to whether they want to play chess programs or not. People who use chess engines against their opponents are very deceptive. That's the point you're missing.
The only one missing the point here is you.
What point am I missing?
Sometimes reasonable people miss the point that life is quite often not reasonable and cannot be dealt with in a reasonable way.
Sure, I would like to know. But, since it is not possible, the best thing is to just move on and let it go.
Sometimes reasonable people miss the point that life is quite often not reasonable and cannot be dealt with in a reasonable way.
Sure, I would like to know. But, since it is not possible, the best thing is to just move on and let it go.
We're talking about a simple chess match and not life in general. Life is often unreasonable because some people are. Any experienced chess player can tell if his or her opponent isn't completely honest in playing the game. For instance, 1400 or 1500-rated simply isn't going to get crushed by an 1100-rated player unless that 1100-rated player's using a chess engine on all or some of his or her moves or that an experienced player's helping the 1100-rated player out. I know because I've had this done to me before. My opponent admitted to me that he was getting help from his friends as he shares his account with his friends which is a form of cheating. I became suspicious of his play and started asking questions. So please understand that I find your attitude towards cheating to be highly offensive.
Sometimes reasonable people miss the point that life is quite often not reasonable and cannot be dealt with in a reasonable way.
Sure, I would like to know. But, since it is not possible, the best thing is to just move on and let it go.
We're talking about a simple chess match and not life in general. Life is often unreasonable because some people are. Any experienced chess player can tell if his or her opponent isn't completely honest in playing the game. For instance, 1400 or 1500-rated simply isn't going to get crushed by an 1100-rated player unless that 1100-rated player's using a chess engine on all or some of his or her moves or that an experienced player's helping the 1100-rated player out. I know because I've had this done to me before. My opponent admitted to me that he was getting help from his friends as he shares his account with his friends which is a form of cheating. I became suspicious of his play and started asking questions. So please understand that I find your attitude towards cheating to be highly offensive.
Chess is part of life. Therefore, you cannot expect an environment like online chess to conform itself reasonable expectations.
I find it very strange you would find MY indifference to cheating offensive.
Very strange indeed.
Chess is part of life. Therefore, you cannot expect an environment like online chess to conform itself reasonable expectations.
I find it very strange you would find MY indifference to cheating offensive.
Very strange indeed.
Although chess can hone one's life skills, we must keep in mind that it's still a game, and with any game, sportsmanship and fair play should be key.
Chess is part of life. Therefore, you cannot expect an environment like online chess to conform itself reasonable expectations.
I find it very strange you would find MY indifference to cheating offensive.
Very strange indeed.
Although chess can hone one's life skills, we must keep in mind that it's still a game, and with any game, sportsmanship and fair play should be key.
should...should....should....will never get you anywhere except disappointed.
should...should....should....will never get you anywhere except disappointed.
I disagree with you on that. My sense of right and wrong may be stronger than yours, so how we respond to injustices may be different. Not to get too far off the subject, but we live in an imperfect world, and bad things happen to good people sometimes, but that doesn't mean we should become indifferent or numb to them. I guess the only thing we can agree on is that we disagree.
should...should....should....will never get you anywhere except disappointed.
I disagree with you on that. My sense of right and wrong may be stronger than yours, so how we respond to injustices may be different. Not to get too far off the subject, but we live in an imperfect world, and bad things happen to good people sometimes, but that doesn't mean we should become indifferent or numb to them. I guess the only thing we can agree on is that we disagree.
I'm with you here. I also feel strongly when people abuse others by using engines in what should be a fair game.
I've tried hard to fight cheating on this website, and I've contributed to get scores of cheaters banned. Still, with time, I've come to the conclusion that it wasn't a fight worth fighting anymore. Basically, this website isn't concerned that much about people cheating in chess, and there will always be tons of cheaters here.
So I've simply decided to play long games on another more reliable online website (ICC) and only use chess.com for what is valuable here - ie. interacting with fellow chess amateurs.
The only way I fight cheating these days is simply by informing people that yes, it exists, but there's not much to do about it except play elsewhere.
And though I can't say I have a lot of sympathy for decredico's blunt cynicism, I agree with him that the best way to play interesting and fair games is to go play OTB.
I'm with you here. I also feel strongly when people abuse others by using engines in what should be a fair game.
I've tried hard to fight cheating on this website, and I've contributed to get scores of cheaters banned. Still, with time, I've come to the conclusion that it wasn't a fight worth fighting anymore. Basically, this website isn't concerned that much about people cheating in chess, and there will always be tons of cheaters here.
So I've simply decided to play long games on another more reliable online website (ICC) and only use chess.com for what is valuable here - ie. interacting with fellow chess amateurs.
The only way I fight cheating these days is simply by informing people that yes, it exists, but there's not much to do about it except play elsewhere.
And though I can't say I have a lot of sympathy for decredico's blunt cynicism, I agree with him that the best way to play interesting and fair games is to go play OTB.
Thank you for understanding! I'm glad that you can be sensible about this, and I feel the same way about Chess.com not caring too much about cheaters on this site.
I'm with you here. I also feel strongly when people abuse others by using engines in what should be a fair game.
I've tried hard to fight cheating on this website, and I've contributed to get scores of cheaters banned. Still, with time, I've come to the conclusion that it wasn't a fight worth fighting anymore. Basically, this website isn't concerned that much about people cheating in chess, and there will always be tons of cheaters here.
So I've simply decided to play long games on another more reliable online website (ICC) and only use chess.com for what is valuable here - ie. interacting with fellow chess amateurs.
The only way I fight cheating these days is simply by informing people that yes, it exists, but there's not much to do about it except play elsewhere.
And though I can't say I have a lot of sympathy for decredico's blunt cynicism, I agree with him that the best way to play interesting and fair games is to go play OTB.
Keelof and Rdecredico deserve each other! Since they tolerate cheating, they can cheat each other!
A seven year old thread comes back to life, and mirrors the same hard-edged perspectives that you can read every day in the Cheating Forum group.
Thanks for the posts, @Hicetnunc.
Good to read a perspective both experienced and thoughtful.
I'm with you here. I also feel strongly when people abuse others by using engines in what should be a fair game.
I've tried hard to fight cheating on this website, and I've contributed to get scores of cheaters banned. Still, with time, I've come to the conclusion that it wasn't a fight worth fighting anymore. Basically, this website isn't concerned that much about people cheating in chess, and there will always be tons of cheaters here.
So I've simply decided to play long games on another more reliable online website (ICC) and only use chess.com for what is valuable here - ie. interacting with fellow chess amateurs.
The only way I fight cheating these days is simply by informing people that yes, it exists, but there's not much to do about it except play elsewhere.
And though I can't say I have a lot of sympathy for decredico's blunt cynicism, I agree with him that the best way to play interesting and fair games is to go play OTB.
Keelof and Rdecredico deserve each other! Since they tolerate cheating, they can cheat each other!
Hey, you can have your petty little crybaby opinion if you want. But don't be an asshole and start saying that we cheat. Just because I don't get bent out of shape over cheaters hardly means I cheat. I take my chess development quite seriously.
Long quotes followed by long-winded put downs. That's hardly persuasive, guys.
What "pyschological impulse" makes you pile on the whinners, and with such vigor ??
The gentlemen doth protest too strongly.
Kleelof sorry I didn't mean "perfect moves." I meant I checked the game vs an engine afterwards and he played the recommended move 100% of the time after his initial mistake
Necro
I am playing a higher rated player in a tournament and I firmly believe that he is cheating--- i have evidence of this. How do I report this?
I am playing a higher rated player in a tournament and I firmly believe that he is cheating--- i have evidence of this. How do I report this?
Please click on "Help & Support" at the bottom of the web page and then click on "Contact" in the upper right-hand side of the page. From there, you'll see a topic with "General" on it. Click on "General," and you'll see a list of options. Click on "Report Abuse."
When you see something that isn't right, the choice is always - do I do something about it (where I may get bad feelings, but where I may actually achieve something) or do I just ignore it (where I may still get bad feelings, but where I also may just forget about it and be ok).
The answer is case-specific and personality-specific...