Im black. Opponent is white. If he had more time he probably would of beat me.
Opponent ran out of time. How did this become a draw?
Sort:
Jul 18, 2017
0
#2
You had insufficient mating material (can't force mate with only king + B), which is a draw when your opponent times out.
A common blitz strategy if you're going to lose on time in a winning position is at least try to make it a draw by capturing all your opponents pawns.
A common blitz strategy if you're going to lose on time in a winning position is at least try to make it a draw by capturing all your opponents pawns.
Jul 18, 2017
0
#3
1818-1828271 wrote:
You had insufficient mating material (can't force mate with only king + B), which is a draw when your opponent times out.
Ah, interesting, didn't know that either. Although, imho, the question shouldn't be if Black can _force_ a mate with K + B only, but if it is at all _possible_ that Black mates if White plays the dumbest moves ever.
Jul 18, 2017
0
#4
Check out some of the other conversations that go into this in some detail: https://www.chess.com/forum/search?keyword=time+out+draw
https://www.chess.com/forum/view/general/what-is-quottime-out-vs-insufficient-materialquot has some detailed observations.
Jul 18, 2017
0
#5
fschmitz422 wrote:
1818-1828271 wrote:
You had insufficient mating material (can't force mate with only king + B), which is a draw when your opponent times out.
Ah, interesting, didn't know that either. Although, imho, the question shouldn't be if Black can _force_ a mate with K + B only, but if it is at all _possible_ that Black mates if White plays the dumbest moves ever.
Been trying to mate as black for fun with white making really dumb moves. It's hard. This is the only way I can think of to do it.
The white king would have to promote to a light squared bishop and use his own bishop to block him in a dark squared corner. Probably other ways but that's all I came up with.
Jul 18, 2017
0
#6
Christ, this is giving me headaches. How to prove that White can _avoid_ to be mated? You cannot just place K + K + B on an empty board, disregarding the actual position of Whites's pieces and pawns. Problem is : Engine won't help any, since not designed for this task.
I confess: Already had 4 cans, possibly confused.
Jul 18, 2017
0
#7
Interestingly, the new FIDE rules state that as long as a checkmate is possible with the material left on the board (even if it's a ridiculous selfmate that would never happen) then it is a win.
Jul 18, 2017
0
#8
@Slow_pawn, @david,
ok, posting overlap, I'll check your stuff, thanks
Jul 18, 2017
0
#9
fschmitz422 wrote:
Christ, this is giving me headaches. How to prove that White can _avoid_ to be mated? You cannot just place K + K + B on an empty board, disregarding the actual position of Whites's pieces and pawns. Problem is : Engine won't help any, since not designed for this task.
I confess: Already had 4 cans, possibly confused.
The way I figured it could happen, if white was trying to be mated that is, is to move all of his pieces to a square that the black king could just take them for free, all but a single pawn that promotes on a light square, promote to a bishop, move his king to a corner dark square and park there, then just shuffle his light squared bishop back and forth while black sets up the mate I've shown above.
Edit: I just wanted to try it for fun. It's an impossible mate to force.
Jul 18, 2017
0
#10
I give up for today, need to get some sleep now - @all : Thanks a lot for your thoughts!
And, like always: Whenever you need a Leibniz medal laureate, there's no one around.
Jul 18, 2017
0
#11
I think this should be a win for black. White could underpromote to a bishop, lose the rest of his pieces, and be mated as in diagram #5. The rules don't require the weaker side to be able to force mate; they just need enough material for mate to be possible by any combination of legal moves, which exists in OP's position. Note that when I say "rules", I'm referring to OTB rules and not chess.com rules
Insuffiecent mating material.
lol this is funny
Jul 18, 2017
0
#14
Hurried_Salad_WOW wrote:
WOW. I knew something like this was possible. Each side with 1 bishop and 1 king. Although, the pawn could have been promoted to a knight and it was checkmate next move also.
The black king would be in check if white promoted to a knight on g8.
Jul 18, 2017
0
#15
you won that game. complain to chess.com so they at least fix the bug. you can reference this article. https://www.chess.com/article/view/the-lonely-bishop-chekmate
Jul 18, 2017
0
#16
I don't think it's a bug. I think chess.com knows that their rule about insufficient mating material is different from OTB rules, which they can do if they want
Jul 19, 2017
0
#17
Pyotrvich wrote:
Interestingly, the new FIDE rules state that as long as a checkmate is possible with the material left on the board (even if it's a ridiculous selfmate that would never happen) then it is a win.
That's has been the FIDE rule for a long time. It just isn't trivial to program an algorithm to test that so the site uses a modified version of the USCF rules (the rule here differs in some cases from the USCF one) which only tests the material left by the player with time.
Or this way.For mate
Even knights are not spared in over the board games. Two examples are as follows.
