There can be a big surprise when a decent USCF master [2350 or so] plays correspondence. I remember one just starting playing correpondence and was expecting to do well. I beat him in about 8 or 9 moves and he then withdrew from the correspondence tourament.
[ He tried again later and then his over the board and correspondence chess ratings were similar.]
How can using a computer ever be considered "playing chess?"
1pawndown wrote:
How can using a computer ever be considered "playing chess?"
+1
@firebrandx
I can see your point for some people but it's just not for me. Here's why.
I play cc because I just can't seem to think fast enough in faster games cuz I'm still learning :)
I especially have a slow go of it in the opening phase cuz there are so many options and I'm overwhelmed.
I can understand the use of an opening data base which shows the % of advantage for white/black/draw, since I have used an app for openings in past games (only for approx the first 4-5 moves) to try to get an understanding of what to do in the beginning. Personally I don't like the use of computers in cc cuz I want my brain to do the work that way I remember better instead of just point and click to see what's best for the position. I guess I just "learn" better my way for now.... Maybe when I get better and study deeper theory I'll come around :)
Thanks for the info.
Really enjoying this thread
A few points...
Well, I'm playing some games on the USCF server, but it really sucks!
I really don't understand why USCF cannot have the same quality chess.com has! And I believe the USCF has much more money since they milk every chess player in US!
There are endless bugs! At a certain point the black moves are written in white's side, the time ends, and the player winning for time doesn't get the game adjudicated. When the other player moves the email doesn't arrive to tell me that the other player moved, and so on. The help service (please contact us... they are making fun of those who do!) never answer when there are problems.
I don't know, but it seems that the president of the USCF for keeping the money in the family gave the job to his son or nephew for running the correspondence site. I never saw such a poor job, apart in non-professional who don't make a living out of it.
Let's hope chess.com considers one day to substitute the USCF, because it would work surely better.
I'm starting out in ICCF, and I'm confused: does it or does it not affect your USCF correspondence rating? And if it is not recognized by USCF, is there any point in paying entry fees for a rating that isn't prestigious? Am I mistaken? Thanks in advance for the reply.
ICCF has no impact on USCF corr rating. USCF has no impact on ICCF rating.
Prestigious is up to you, but also remember it's a different ruleset about computers. I don't care much about my USCF rating, but then again I don't try very hard at it. Then again there are a lot of people who care because they want to play in an environment where they presumably aren't up against computers.
the USCF doesn't milk its players. that is Bill Goichberg of the CCA and President of the USCF. his business the Continental Chess Association runs most of the Major events in the U.S.A for profit. He claimes they lose money every year for the last 20 years. But then how can they afford to run it again? Good question to ponder while I also inform you of this. The USCF also run by Bill goichberg gets discounts on all his advertisements in the USCF MAgazine "Chess Life" and becuase of his affiliation as president of the USCF is granted extra special discounts at the location that he holds CCA events. What makes it even more interesting is that the USCF Claims to support those who want to run big tournaments but Bugles ad placements in thier own magazines that compete with CCA events. But mysteriously get CCA events entered in upcoming magazines ontime and without errors. Anyone else would be forced to uphold all errors printed as "THE USCF is not responsible for Typographical errors" as it was told to me. Even though they were responisble for making a mistake they didn't pay me for it or even give me what I paid for. Instead I was dragged ina fight with a tournament directors board for not paying out the money esatblished in thier magazine (which was an error on thier part) and forced to pay out almost double what I had intended. That same day CCA was running a tournaemnt over 100 miles away and mysterious thier event was without any errors, thier ad got published 3 months early. Mine was published 2 months late!! and thier prizes were correctly stated. But mine were in error becuase of 2 words (Based On) Which instead they wrote Guaranteed. which cost me $3000. instead of $1500.. And you guys are wondering how they can't put together a CC Event.. hahah it's not profitable. Plain and simple
Sorry but there are few things that I cannot understand from your message.
1. Why someone from Angola would care about the USCF, since that is the flag you have chosen. Hoping you are not using someone else country to avoid slander suits, instead of showing your true nationality.
2. What is the relation of your complaint, with correspondence chess, and with the new USCF for playing correspondence chess online.
3. It seems you didn't spell check your text, which is full of mistakes. It seems written poorly, and that could reflect on your credibility. Maybe you should ask some Americans or English people to correct it, and post it again in the general forum.
Good luck with your crusade.
I playe one of these (ICCF) for fun, and fun it was not. It taught me how to build a computer for just chess and how to setup the software and databases, but after that, you just let the computer run over night and you draw 75% of the games and win the rest...and I won my tournament. Took months to play one tournament and would not do it again.
Fire guy I will be interested in reading your book whenever it comes out!
I have a question. Long time ago I had ICCF/FIDE rating over 2500 but I needed three more games to make it a permanent rating. If I played 3 more games now would I then have an official ICCF/FIDE permanent rating? Or would my absence of chess for so many years make a situation where now I need a lot more than 3 games?
Here is a line I once played against a powerful team [headed by a now correspondence grandmaster] which none of the team or their chess engines saw and nobody of the dozens looking in each day saw coming. My chess engine also did not see this line.
White to move and win...It is a series of moves and not easy..
I am not 100% sure I have position set up right but after 1.Ne4 Black plays 1. ...Kd4 rather than 1. ...Bb6?
Zero interest in ever playing in an organization that allows computer-engine use, whether that be ICCF or USCF. I'd rather put up with cheaters. If USCF's correspondence games ever change to allowing the use of computer engines, I will just change to not being interested any longer.
No, it isn't supposed to make anyone feel bad. I posted in this thread for the same reason you did: to give my opinion. Not sure why that is confusing or surprising, or whatever.
I don't have zero interest in correspondence chess. I have zero interest in computer engines being allowed in the games I play. I don't see why that would preculde me from posting in this thread since it is about correspondence chess sponsored by USCF, which I am a member of. I didn't take a dump on anything, thank you. I expressed that I would not be interested in the game if the discussed change (allowing engines) were made. I'm sorry if you don't like me expressing this opinion, but I will buzz off when I am good and ready. Don't like it? Tough.
Incidentally, if I might have permission to post in the thread again without getting my head snapped off, I have played a couple of correspondence games on the USCF site. I was not terribly impressed with the UI. There also didn't seem to be any ratings or stats or anything like that in place. I would like to see an overhaul in the UI before anything serious starts to happen with it, personally.
Firebrand, while you are essentially right it is quite a long process and the way I did it was unique enough that my Fritz does not get the zap move when it is played unless forced to think about it.'
1. Ne4 Kd4 2. b3 Be5 3. g5 Bc7 4. Nd6 [!] Kc3 48. Nb7 Kb4 49. Ke4 Bg7 and now the move I have to make my Fritz do as it would not do it on its own. 50. Nxa5 Even though it is possible to win without this very last move--I was proud to find it before the start of the series with 1. Ne4.
Many unlookers to the game could not figure out 50. Nxa5 although the team I was playing "got it" and gave me a series of "if" moves to show how 50. Nxa5 works to the public looking on ending in a winning position for me and then they resigned.
Maybe so, but you're still playing against a stacked deck. As I said in the posts you quoted, I personally know of players that top the USCF CC charts that are 100% guaranteed using computer assistance. As such, you're often going to lose to new players that are also using computer assistance. I'd rather not worry about it to begin with by either:
A - Only playing with friends I can trust.
B - Playing on a level field where my rating isn't trumped by someone breaking the rules.
I don't understand how you know that the top rated players use engines in USCF CC events. Then I also don't understand why they don't do anything about it, since in chess.com there are endless lists of people whose accounts are closed because they cheated.