Why are Chess Lessons so overpriced?

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Martin_Stahl

The main way to get better is to eliminate weknesses. A good coach can probably diagnose your weaknesses much better, and faster, than most books, and not by trial and error. They can also provide you with a more tailored plan to meet your goals.

 

I'm working the book route and it isn't as fast or as motivational as a coach could be. I also have to pinpoint my own weakesses and try to fix them. 

GodsPawn2016
Martin_Stahl wrote:

The main way to get better is to eliminate weknesses. A good coach can probably diagnose your weaknesses much better, and faster, than most books, and not by trial and error. They can also provide you with a more tailored plan to meet your goals.

 

I'm working the book route and it isn't as fast or as motivational as a coach could be. I also have to pinpoint my own weakesses and try to fix them. 

Exactly!  My coach had me send him 10 of my most recent games.  Wins, draws, and losses.  From those games he developed, and tailored a study plan for me.  As helpful as books are, they cant do that for you, plus books dont offer feed back.

SmyslovFan

This isn't either/or. A good coach will usually ask what books you already have and maybe recommend some additional books. Even Dvoretsky used books to help his students, and he focused on players who were already +2250 FIDE, or if they were over 11 years old, IMs and GMs.

bbeltkyle89
Jimmykay wrote:

$50 could buy you 2 or 3 good chess books that would keep you busy for hundreds of hours, if you really studied them. I am not sure why anyone under 1800 thinks that $50 is better spent on even 5 hours with a coach instead of a few good books.

But $50 wont buy you understanding of the material of the books. Not everyone can read a chess book and come away with 100% understanding of every concept. If you read a passage and come away thinking 2+2=5, then it will have to be someone else to correct your understanding. For example, some material might lead you to be too dogmatic about a particular principle.  It would be up to a coach to present positions that demonstrate when that principle doesn't apply.

Sure, books are great....but you need a reciprocal mind to bounce something off of and test your understanding.

Jimmykay
GodsPawn2016 wrote:
Jimmykay wrote:

$50 could buy you 2 or 3 good chess books that would keep you busy for hundreds of hours, if you really studied them. I am not sure why anyone under 1800 thinks that $50 is better spent on even 5 hours with a coach instead of a few good books.

As it has been said before.  I think a lot of it has to do with what you want to get out of chess.  I made it to USCF A class on my own.  Nut to make Expert i know that i need a coach to guide me there.  Just my opinion...

So you agree with me!

GodsPawn2016
Jimmykay wrote:
GodsPawn2016 wrote:
Jimmykay wrote:

$50 could buy you 2 or 3 good chess books that would keep you busy for hundreds of hours, if you really studied them. I am not sure why anyone under 1800 thinks that $50 is better spent on even 5 hours with a coach instead of a few good books.

As it has been said before.  I think a lot of it has to do with what you want to get out of chess.  I made it to USCF A class on my own.  Nut to make Expert i know that i need a coach to guide me there.  Just my opinion...

So you agree with me!

Its not a matter of agreeing with anyone.  I can only use myself as an example.  I believe a coach is not needed unless its for one of two reasons:

1. Prodigy.

2. A regular player like myself that is trying to attain a goal.

GodsPawn2016
DavidJSmith wrote:

A coach can do what a book cannot. Coach can see where you are and what you need. Book has to do a lot of assuming.

I had a parent ask me before commiting to lessons for her son.  "Why" a coach would be more helpful than just books.  I told her that you can read all the books you want on brain surgery, but that doesnt mean you can perform brain surgery.

Den_Jeizu

you what free lessons? go to torrent

jesterville

Why does the epi-pen sell for US$400-600 in the US, when it's cost price is only US$25? That same pen in Canada is being sold for CAN$100. No, it's not supply and demand...it's just greed.

The same thing with chess lessons. suppliers want to charge as much as they can get away with. The whole supply and demand arguement is based on a perfect world...but we all know that those assumtions are false. I agree with you that the price is inflated...but name one price of a produce that isn't. Greed.

SmyslovFan

Jesterville, there's no government subsidies protecting chess lessons. And in economic terms, chess is an elastic, flexible item while pharmaceuticals are inelastice, necessary items.

That's quite a difference. 

MrDodgy

I give lessons for 1 beer an hour.  But you get what you pay for.

bbeltkyle89
SmyslovFan wrote:

Jesterville, there's no government subsidies protecting chess lessons. And in economic terms, chess is an elastic, flexible item while pharmaceuticals are inelastice, necessary items.

That's quite a difference. 

+1

x-2133653114
Andre_Harding wrote:

Coaches have spent many years acquiring the knowledge they have, and gaining the experience to prepare lessons and teach effectively.

Also, there is a HUGE price difference when it comes to online lessons versus going to a student's home. I go to my students' homes (this is how lessons are nearly always given in New York City) which requires a great deal of time and expense. Parents understand this, and on the flip side of paying for the convenience of not having to travel anywhere for the lesson.

With most children, personal interaction with the coach is important, so online or skype lessons are out of the question. Such students would not take lessons at all if they couldn't get a coach to come to their home.

In short, there are many "non-chess" considerations, not even getting into some of the issues mentioned in previous posts.

Add it all up, and that is why I (and basically any teacher in NYC worth their salt) charges what we do ($100+ per hour).

Here's an experiment:

See how much it costs to get a reading, music, or SAT teacher to come to your home. If I could teach the SAT, I would make a hell of a lot more money than I do teaching chess.

I guess those prices might be relevant for the services your provide in New York City, but when you say, "Coaches have spent many years acquiring the knowledge they have, and gaining the experience to prepare lessons and teach effectively". - I don't believe that is too true for all coaches. 

x-2133653114
jesterville wrote:

Why does the epi-pen sell for US$400-600 in the US, when it's cost price is only US$25? That same pen in Canada is being sold for CAN$100. No, it's not supply and demand...it's just greed.

The same thing with chess lessons. suppliers want to charge as much as they can get away with. The whole supply and demand arguement is based on a perfect world...but we all know that those assumtions are false. I agree with you that the price is inflated...but name one price of a produce that isn't. Greed

 

Could certaintly by part of it. 

bbeltkyle89
KiNgNiCk23 wrote:
jesterville wrote:

Why does the epi-pen sell for US$400-600 in the US, when it's cost price is only US$25? That same pen in Canada is being sold for CAN$100. No, it's not supply and demand...it's just greed.

The same thing with chess lessons. suppliers want to charge as much as they can get away with. The whole supply and demand arguement is based on a perfect world...but we all know that those assumtions are false. I agree with you that the price is inflated...but name one price of a produce that isn't. Greed

 

Could certaintly by part of it. 

no..its really not. As another person has already noted, items can be elastic or inelastic.  This refers to the percentage change of quantity demanded with a percentage change in price.  Generally speaking, if the price of chess lessons went up, there will be less people who purchase it.  With epipens, there is generally a stable population that requires it, and raising the price of it does not change the fact that they need it.  This is theory but obviously in practice there is a limit, as now we are seeing public outrage and hopefully some regulations, or perhaps the market will acquire more information for substitutes.

Fact is, sure they want to charge "as much as they can get away with", just as any consumer wants to pay the lowest price possible.  But when it comes to an elastic good such as chess lessons, they are not going to get away with nearly as much as something like the epipen.  

x-2133653114

Yeah, that makes sense. I agree with you on that. The fact is that I doubt most of these chess instructors are actually booked all day with classes or even give chess lessons as their daily jobs, so really even a coach who works two hours a day at $80 an hour is making over 40 grand a year. Absolutely ridiculous... The thing is that one coach to the next does not stick out... They all say the same and do the same... There is no way to tell whether one coach is better than the next... No competition. Just complete domination. It's great for them I guess, but only affordable to the very rich. Weird sport chess is... 

KassySC

Try to find a singing coach,trumpet coach,tennis instructor who charges much less than $50/hr.Unless for absolute beginners or for group lessons you won't find it. We did a private tennis lesson for my son. $30/hr from lowest level instructor. As he gets better it goes up to $60/hr

jonnin

unless you are one of less than about 50 people, you only really have a small number of ways to make money at chess.  Say you had a "lowly" 2300 rating...

you can write a book / web articles/ news stories/ puzzles / etc

you can teach/analysis of games/etc for lower ranked players

you can play scam/hustle in public places;  one guy I know set up a table at an outdoor fair for $10 a game people might as well have just handed him their wallets.   The bulk of players barely know the moves and he was a lower rated GM.  I admittedly played a couple but I knew what I was up against, I simply don't get to play and chat with GMs much, the best at our small club was under 2000.  

Teaching is one of the rather few and limited ways to make use of a high degree of skill that isnt quite good enough to win the big tournaments. 

Martin_Stahl
KiNgNiCk23 wrote:

Yeah, that makes sense. I agree with you on that. The fact is that I doubt most of these chess instructors are actually booked all day with classes or even give chess lessons as their daily jobs, so really even a coach who works two hours a day at $80 an hour is making over 40 grand a year. Absolutely ridiculous... The thing is that one coach to the next does not stick out... They all say the same and do the same... There is no way to tell whether one coach is better than the next... No competition. Just complete domination. It's great for them I guess, but only affordable to the very rich. Weird sport chess is... 

 

That hypothetical coach would make that much, gross. If a coach is charging that much it is likely due to the fact they are very good, really high rated, or only want students that are very serious.

 

After taxes and healthcare, they would probably be better off working a regular job.

 

The funny thing here is that most people that complain would be insulted if someone offered them $10/hour to complete a task they are highly skilled at. 

Texasgrape

Let the free market set the price, it's how it's supposed to work.  If enough people do not hire them, their rate will go down . . . if more people hire them, their rate goes up.  It's a good proven system even if people like me can't afford the $50 per hour.  Evidently people are hiring them if the price consistently stays at that rate.